By Will GreenSomething that always perplexed me about the Book of Job is that it seems God doesn't consider Himself accountable to His creatures.
From
Wikipedia:
God's speech also emphasizes his sovereignty in creating and maintaining the world. The thrust is not merely that God has experiences that Job does not, but that God is king over the world and is not necessarily subject to questions from his creatures, including men. The point of these speeches is to proclaim the absolute freedom of God over His creation. God is not in need of the approval of his creation. It is only the reader of the book who learns of God's conversations with Satan; Job himself remains unaware of the reason or source of his sufferings. The traditional interpretation is that, humbled by God's chastising, Job turns speechless, giving up and repenting his previous requests of justice. However, another interpretation is that Job's silence is defiant, and that what he gives up is not his belief that justice be done, but his confidence that God will behave justly.I don't mean that God has no good reason to allow suffering. God may have a fantastic reason. My concern was I didn't understand why we can't hold God to account.
For example, surely if you had a child who was suffering, while their parent was standing around and could seemingly assist that child, then it would be reasonable to demand that the parent explain their inaction. Maybe the parent has an excellent reason, e.g. the pain involved in the medical operation was necessary for the child's future health. But, at least with parents, courts can demand an explanation for apparently negligent actions.
It occurred to me that one way to justify the Book of Job's position might come from the definition of God.
Consider these verses:
James 1:13: "When tempted, no one should say, "God is tempting me." For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone"Titus 1:2: "in the hope of eternal life, which God, who cannot lie, promised long ages ago"Hebrews 6:18: "God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope offered to us may be greatly encouraged."They seem to say that God is unable, not just unwilling, to sin (maybe because sin means acting on some untruth, and truth is so firmly planted in God that He cannot so act).
If you define God as a being who is unable - not just unwilling, but unable - to commit evil, then asking God whether or not He is committing evil seems a bit silly. It would be like defining a triangle as an object with three sides and then asking why there is no fourth side. E.g. the answer why there is no fourth side is that a triangle can only have three sides. Similarly, if God is defined as unable to do evil, then you already know whether that particular God has committed evil before you even ask the question.
Under the definition of God as a being who is unable to commit evil, it's fair to say that you shouldn't demand that God tell you whether He is committing evil. Why? Because, with that assumption, the question doesn't make sense. If you already accept that God is unable to do evil, then the answer has to be: God didn't commit evil.
So I suppose you can make an argument that if you are running with view that God is unable to commit evil, then you shouldn't question God because the question is nonsensical.
Applying this to Job, one main difference is that even though the Bible tells us that God is unable to commit evil, by looking at the world we can have some doubt about that. So are we really in the position of being able to say God cannot commit evil before we discuss the problem of suffering?
If we can't start off with that assumption, then you can't say that questioning God is nonsensical.
I would say that if we look at the world, then yes, we don't know that God is a being who is unable to commit evil, but consider the issue from the point-of-view of a God who is unable to commit evil and created the world. According to this God's point-of-view, He is allowed to disagree with our negative impression. For this God knows the real situation. So from that God's point-of-view, maybe He is allowed to say, 'Well, if you knew the truth, then you would know it is nonsensical to question me', and put forth this view to His creations.
In summing up, I think that for people who don't know that God cannot commit evil, I don't think it's necessarily wrong to question God. But this doesn't take away from the fact that from God's point-of-view, questioning His goodness is literally nonsensical (assuming us Christians are right), on the basis of inability. That is, on the basis that God is unable to do evil, it makes no sense to ask whether God did evil. So I suppose that God could in this way have a right to tell people they are unable to question His ethical conduct.
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Comments (9)
As I commented on OP.
But this doesn't take away from the fact that from God's point-of-view, questioning His goodness is literally nonsensical (assuming us Christians are right), on the basis of inability.
I agree. One thing about the story of Job is that afterward, God blessed Job with twice as much as he had before
If we take seriously Jesus' words, that we should seek first the Kingdom of God, or the words of Proverbs, that we should trust in the Lord with all our heart and lean not to our own understanding, we could easily see that God's wisdom is above ours. Also, God is sovereign and immutable - does not change.
Our problem is most likely that we think of this present life and our preferences as being all in all. None of us is going to make it off this planet alive - or at least not without being changed, so our physical life is transient and short. We have no guarantee how long it will be. People dying is people leaving earth according to reality. Our troubles and worries are short-sighted as well.
"Christians" who question God's goodness baffle me. How and why did they ever trust Him to begin with?
It seems somehow wrong for any definition of God to speak of limitations. God is Good; God is Love.
We can be sure that God will not do evil, because it is completely against God's nature.
Jesus came into the world and allowed us to question Him. By questioning, we come to know God.
@musterion99@xanga -
If a parent loses one or two or three or more beloved children or if a husband loses the woman he loves there is no way to ever "replace" these loved ones. All of this and more happened to Job and there is no way for God to replace those terrible losses or make it right.
Well, i'd like to reply as an atheist. I agree with you that if you accept that God is good by definition, then it makes no sense to question his goodness. However, i'd argue that it makes no sense to accept that something is good by definition. We do not ascribe traits to things simply by defining them as having those traits. We could not just "define" Barack Obama as Asian, for example, and then say, "well, he must be Asian somehow because his definition says that he is". Instead of starting with a conclusion that can overrule all evidence, we use our evidence to arrive at, and to form, a conclusion. I don't think a reasonable God would expect us to do otherwise.
If God is unable to do something, whatever this something might be, then God is to that extent limited.
As to the question do we have the right to question God: the Bible appears to give us that right as we often see characters in the Bible questioning, second guessing, complaining about what God has caused to happen or ignored, etc.
Simply read the Psalms and witness how often complaints and questions are brought to God. I think if we cannot do something as human as bitch about things to our Creator then I state this makes nonsense the often heard claim that we are in a relationship with God in Christ. Only very dysfunctional relationships demand that no criticism of the other is voiced.
@Logomachy@xanga - I would agree that the Bible gives us many examples of people questioning God, and that a relationship that does not allow questioning does sound dysfunctional. I suppose that is another difficulty with the Book of Job, because in many other places in the Bible characters seem to criticise God a lot. So I would say that it's better to criticise God than keep some discontent bottle up in one's mind, because God knows about all one's feelings anyway. But I suppose if God is always perfectly good, then there is some answer out there that can satisfy people. I expect God will give some account to us of reasons after we die.
@Logomachy@xanga - You're right. They can't be replaced. As for making it right, if God really exists as the bible describes his attributes, then he is always right. We are not capable of knowing all his purposes.
Nonsensical? Unable? You upset me!
Revelation 1:8 the Lord God says, "I am the Alpha and the Omega, who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."
Is it that he cannot do evil? No. It is that there is a reason for all things on Earth. I might not know of it, but what can I honestly say? I'm only human. My life here on Earth is short lived. What is 100 years of human years to God? It is nothing more than a mere speck. Perhaps even microscopic. My point is, God's wisdom is bountiful. Drink it so that you could grow, and live a life worth living.