Friday, 16 March 2012
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Me and My Muslim Girlfriend: Searching for God's True Word
By "Oneshotblogger"
Last month I was sitting in church with my girlfriend. It was very quiet and warm in the church. Everything was at peace. We sat in one of the pews, holding hands and enjoying the silence. My girlfriend turned towards me and whispered: "I have wish."
"You have a wish?" I asked.
"Yes, wish," she answered. English is not her first language.
"What do you wish?"
"I wish this moment is never stop."
"Me too," I said, "We're in a church. Let's pray and ask Jesus to not ever let this moment stop."
"Okay," she said. She put her hands together and said: "Mr. Jesus, please, make this moment forever and never stop."
I started laughing despite myself. "Mr. Jesus." It was so cute! At that moment I realized, like a bolt of white light, that I was in love with my girlfriend. I loved her. I loved her passionately and I wanted to spend the rest of my life with her.
Of course the moment in the church did not last forever. After about a half hour we got up and left. She went back to work and I returned to the clinic where I had my afternoon shift.
Still, that white light moment that appeared in my head while my girlfriend and I were in church stayed with me all that day. I have no doubt that God was speaking to me, telling me of my love for my girlfriend.
There are many people, however, who disapprove of my relationship with my girlfriend. I am a Christian and she is a secular Muslim whose family is from Kazakhstan. My girlfriend goes to church services with me and I sort of know that she only does so to please me -- not because she actually believes that Jesus Christ is her Lord and Saviour.
I do the same sort of thing. When we went to visit her family in Astana during the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, I also attended services with her parents. I fasted with them from sunrise to sunset, not because I believe in Islam but because I owed respect towards the parents of the girl I was dating. When I spoke to my girlfriend's parents, I knew within my heart that their souls were just as sincere and intact and full of love as any Christian.
It makes me sad when my relationship is condemned by people who are in my church. The Bible is quoted as proof that interfaith relationships are inappropriate. I know that the Bible is the Word of God -- but it is the Word of God spoken through the mouths of men. The Bible has been translated from Aramaic to Hebrew to English throughout the millennia. The Word of God has been filtered through the minds and pens of countless scholars.
God's Word still shines through the pages of the Bible, but it is like viewing shining light through a grimy window pane. For example, what does Exodus 20: 4-5 mean when God says "I am a jealous god" ? What does He mean by using the article "a" before "god?" That implies that He is one of many gods, but God is the only God. There are no others. Also, why is God jealous? Why does he commit that sin? Isn't God perfect in His Essence? Why would He be susceptible to the sin of jealousy?
And later on in the Book of Exodus, why does God who is so offended by abortion nowadays showing no pity towards the innocent lives of the Egyptian first-born? And in the Book of Job why does God torture Job over a cruel curiosity about what would make the poor man break? Incidences and contradictions like these seem like chinks and cracks in translation that have come about only through the fallibility of imperfect scholarship by imperfect men -- not God.
There are, however, many passages in the Bible where I see a closer version of the pure light of God shining through the letters. My favorite quote is Luke 6:29: "And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also" The necessity of kindness even towards those who are cruel to you seems closer to the nature of God, in my opinion, than a thousand words necessitating the stoning of idolators.
Nevertheless God is often used by men as an excuse for sinful behavior. In the early seventeenth century local colonial officials in Massachusetts would abuse the name of God by proclaiming a few landowners "witches" and offenders of all that was holy. These landowners were condemned in kangaroo courts and put to death. The local government would then seize their property... which was, of course, the government's intention in the first place. Even today I see officials commit the sins of the Pharisees by speaking out of both corners of their mouths. They proclaim their devotion to Jesus Christ... and then use the name of the Prince of Peace as a justification to go to war and commit great violence for the government's own benefit.
When I see this occur I feel so sad inside. It is the duty of every good Christian, in my opinion, to try to separate the true shining light of God's Word from the dirt smears of man's sinful nature cleverly masquerading as the Word of God. It is so difficult, however, to experience God's Word and know that it is untouched by the sins of the men who translate for Him. I don't know exactly how to recognize when I am experiencing God's true wisdom and when I am experiencing the normal, mortal sinful words of men that pretend to be repeating the Word of God. It is difficult.
I think that quiet moment in the church when, with a great bolt of light inside my head, I knew that I was with the woman that I wanted to marry -- I think that was the closest I ever got to experiencing the true Word of God. I have, in my interfaith relationship, never felt more holy.
What are your thoughts on this man's search for God's true Word? How are we to handle scripture if it is, in fact, so tainted by the hands of man? Is the Bible really as fallible as this author suggests?
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Comments (85)
It is a very delicate thing. Not long ago I was in a relationship with a Jewish man who had recently come to the US from Israel. At first it was like the perfect relationship, lots of love and we even got engaged. All of a sudden, things changed. I can't tell exactly if somehow his family or mine had any sort of influence or he gave it a thought, or all of a sudden he got really into his faith anyway, the thing is that he broke up with me and I ended up giving him the ring. His reason? He told me that if he married me our children wouldn't be Jewish, I was a Christian and he didn't want our children to be "confused" regarding he'd tech them their faith and I teach them mine at the same time. It was frustrating, completely heartbreaking, but now I thank him for doing that. Even with all the love and good intensions, faith is a big issue and our relationship was more likely not to work out.
@DraigStudio@xanga - Oh nobody is piling on anyone. He presented his controversal issue on a Christian blog asking for Christian advice of whether or not the decisions he was making were wise or not according to commonly accepted Christianity. He is actually being blessed, not piled on. Better for him to be blessed with this wisdom everyone is giving him so he can avoid some chastising from God. Also, other Christians can learn at the same time.
God Bless,
Brother RobertLeeRE
@xOne_twentyX@xanga - You are very lucky because there are so many couples that have a naive view as to what it takes to keep a marriage working. You both probably saved a lot of heart-ache that would of occurred when the children were old enough to start socialising to the ways of the world.
God Bless,
Brother RobertLeeRE
@DraigStudio@xanga - I read through the comments and didn't see anyone "piling" on him. If he wants to be happy and in love without anyone giving their advice based on biblical teachings, then he wouldn't have brought this up on a Christian blog site. It's not like he posted something unrelated and everyone went to his blog and flamed him there. As a Christian, I dated and married a nonbeliever. I tried to convince myself it was okay and I knew asking a blog full of Christians or a pastor would shatter my efforts. I knew they weren't going to give me validation so I didn't ask. He asked. It wouldn't be right to not give him the answers he's seeking.
To the OP. I married a non believer. He would go to church with me and even pray. You know as well as I do that it's not the same. You even say so in your post. Not being with my husband would hurt, but when it came down to it, it became a problem. I love God more than I love my husband, and I felt that I wasn't right because of my blatant disobedience. We're blessed because after I came to that realization, my husband accepted Christ as his savior. I don't know your relationship with God or your girlfriend. All I can do is tell you my experience and tell you to seek out the advice of a pastor or bible scholar.
@soccerdadforlife@xanga - Ummm... I didn't see one word in this guy's essay about sex. Projecting a little, are we?
@xOne_twentyX@xanga - I'm really glad you made peace with your husband leaving. Still, I hope you don't use that ill-heartedness of his as proof that interfaith relationships don't work. It doesn't matter if a guy is just as observant - or says that he's just as observant- as you. A jerk is a jerk, no matter what he does on Sunday (or Friday, in the case of your husband).
@DraigStudio@xanga - Amen!
@phoebester@xanga - Oh no! I do confess that when he broke our engagement I cried a river but I have no grudges or resent him in any way. I forgave him and totally understand and respect his decision. Now I understand why he did what he did and I am thankful because we've saved ourselves maybe many problems and I am sure he'll find someone he'll be happy with just as I've found a good man too. That was my case, and I've no doubt there are stories of people who found a way to deal with their interfaith relationships and are very happy! and believe me hun, he was not a jerk at all! I think he just thought about our situation in the future and probably saw it wouldn't work for us. :)
@ksivs4477@xanga - You wrote: "Please pass the bacon?" Not cool, sir. Not cool. I am a Christian in seminary and am very offended by that comment.
I'm not exactly sure why you would take umbrage at that comment. It's been my experience that when somebody is either nominal or non-practicing in a particular religious persuasion where pork is forbidden, the dietary regulations are usually the first to be abandoned. I'm not going to mention the name of the one religious persuasion of which I'm thinking, but it shouldn't be too hard to figure out. Anyway, I've known various individuals over the years who claim some connection with this religion, who routinely include ham sandwiches, pork chops, ribs, sausage, bacon, etc. in their diet. In my way of thinking, the "please pass the bacon" comment should not be offensive to the family in question; and if it is, then you have a good idea as to how religious they actually are.
If I have in any way caused you to stumble in your faith (which is the Biblical definition of offense), then I apologize for doing so.
--Pastor Dan
@DraigStudio@xanga - You wrote:
You know what I hate about this.
1.
You did not obtain permission to quote him and you have not even shown
where you got this from and thus you are copyright infringing and
breaking the law. That's a wonderful thing for a pastor to do. As an
artist nothing irritates me more than to see my work used by others
without express written permission. If I was him I would make you take
it down, but I am not.
REPLY: Sorry, but you have neglected to get your facts straight before making a comment. If you had bothered to check the U.S. Copyright laws, you would find in section 107 an explanation of what is called "fair use of copyright material." It says in part: "...quotation of excerpts in a review or criticism for purposes of illustration or comment..." is considered fair use, and permission to do so is not required. You can check it for yourself.
This is a moot point however, because the material I quoted is NOT copyrighted. When something is posted on a website like this, it is being disseminated amongst the general public for comment and review, which is exactly what I did.
I don't know if you actually checked the sermon, but I have included links in two different places that will take people right here with just a click of their mouse, and then they read about the situation in its entirety, along with everybody's comments, including yours.
2. You are judging him and making it seem
fine by wrapping it up in a sermon. That is also an awful thing for any
religious person, let alone a pastor to do.
REPLY: Judging him? I have no power to judge his heart, nor does anybody else on this earth. Only God knows what's going on inside. However, I can comment on what he is doing based upon what he wrote. If he didn't want people (including myself) to comment on this, then he would have never posted it in the first place. People judge actions all of the time, which is evidenced by our statutes and judicial system. And by reading what you have written, you appear to be very well acquainted with what it means to be judgmental.
I know you are using this as
an example, but this seems very underhanded for a pastor, a man of
faith and cloth to do this.
REPLY: Sorry, but I call them the way I see them. That's part of doing the job. At least I'm not bad-mouthing them behind their backs.
It would be one thing if you were
ministering to this man one on one, but for you to spread his heartfelt
love and turn it into something else, to me is disrespectful. You
may mean well, but I think you may be forgetting the biggest thing. They
are in love. They are hurting no one, and they are happy beyond belief.
Why must anyone trample on this.
REPLY: In love? And what does that mean? In my years of ministry, I have counseled with numerous couples who are "in love," but have so much proverbial stardust in their eyes, that they cannot see the harsh reality that awaits them. They have no concept of financial responsibility, parenting, employment, education, and a whole host of things, one of which is religious differences. I've talked with high school kids who are ready to go and elope because they're "in love," and want to get married despite their parents' objections. Those words "in love" are so nebulous and are used so liberally, that they ring hollow after a while. For a couple, "Love" can mean anything from a lifetime commitment to a one-night stand.
I am not religious and I refuse to buy
into the crap of God's will or Jesus this or that. They are IN LOVE!
Love is the only religion I will ever consent to follow. It is all that
matters in the end. Show him some respect.
REPLY: Irrespective of your religious beliefs (or lack thereof), this man professes to be a Christian; and as such, that's the touchstone of truth we're dealing with as far as he is concerned. I would guess that your advice to this couple would be for both of them to abandon whatever religion they have, and just go their merry way and do whatever they please. But we both know that isn't going to happen. Christianity and Islam are not a compatible mix, and this is the point I was making. One or the other (or both) will have to be abandoned, and then there will be consequences to consider. And I can guarantee the outcome isn't going to be pleasant for them. It's the proverbial "Catch 22" situation any way you slice it.
Yes, I respect them. When they seek to do the God-pleasing thing in their relationship, then they will be better prepared to endure the difficulties they will encounter in the future. And I am fully prepared to give them the best Christian advice I can. I can think of no better way to respect their relationship than to prepare them for reality.
And finally, love is my religion too.
"God so loved the world, that he gave his only-begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)
"This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him. In this way, love is made complete among us." (1 John 4:10,16,17)
Peace.
--Pastor Dan
@autumn_cannibal76@xanga - I understand what you're saying and I agree that how we are brought up in our faith has a great influence on how we read scripture. You're right that many translations, especially ones that differ in language, come out with differences between them. But how could they not? Fortunately I don't argue "there is only one interpretation of the Bible, and it just happens to the one I was born with. What a coincidence!" I've been blessed to have not only been raised in my faith by good pastors and laypeople, but also many diverse bible teachers through different bible schools/seminaries. So yes, I've been influenced, as we all have, but I've also been taught to explore the original languages, the Church history, the many ways to study scripture in a way that seeks to understand the original intent of the biblical authors (and ultimately Author), and to submit to these in a way that puts all of them in higher priority than my desires and personal thoughts (which are influenced by far more dangerous forces than a pastor who has favorite motifs within the scriptures).
I'd disagree about the church split. I believe there is more to the issue than that. But more importantly, the individual reading of scripture is different from the type of individualist interpreting that I am highlighting in my comment. To make the scriptures available to the various members of the body of Christ, as opposed to merely making it accessible to the leaders, is far different than saying an individual is free to interpret the scriptures as they see fit while disregarding the interpretations than the Church at large has confirmed as acceptable.
My point is that there are original languages the scriptures were written in, and that it is possible to learn those languages and translate well. To rely more upon individual interpretation than historic and communal (and by communal I mean the church universal) is irresponsible. Of course there is a goodness in being able to interpret on an individual basis and to do so with the Spirit. However, if this is separated or held in higher standing than doing it within the context of the Church then there is a problem. The scriptures are open to individual interpretation, to a degree, but they also demand a submission. Wisdom also demands that individual interpretation, standing alone or in highest regard, is not showing a reverence for God's scripture or Body. We were given more than ourselves by God and we ought to use all he has given us. His scriptures, our knowledge, his Spirit, and his Body which are our teachers and siblings.
@soccerdadforlife@xanga - Correct me if I am wrong, but from what you say in response to this blog simply says that you equate "love" with taking to bed, as you say: ".....so that you can bed ..."
Surely, thats what you equate such love with? isnt it? Here's a young guy seeking to discuss how he can achieve his love in the light of religion and to you it appears only as taking to bed...!! You don't think that any book or faith ever was able to stop anybody going to bed with anyone? If i infer from your reply up there, then it does appear that you believe that way.
A book and faith is a mere suggestion of the rules of life, quite like the trafic rule book which asks us not to overspeed, and not jump lights, but does that ACTUALLy stop us from doing that?
I regret to say that your response is rather objectionable, but well isn't it your right of free speech!! yes it is.
@DraigStudio@xanga - For Christians, being happy is not a supreme goal or value. It's a consequence and/or perk. If a Christian seems to place higher value on self happiness than on faithfulness to God then there is reason for siblings of faith to speak up and remind that person of the priorities they claim to hold a commitment to. Just as anyone would speak up towards someone who they believe is finding happiness in something that seems unhealthy or in opposition to their values. It's similar to an intervention of sorts I suppose (though perhaps not the best of metaphors). An intervention can appear to be a "piling up" on the person being confronted but it's really an act of concern. People can be happy in a great many things that aren't good or don't match their commitments. Happiness ought not be held so highly that it is honored above health or commitments as serious as the Christian life. Even the nonreligious can appreciate that to a strong degree I believe.
please edit
So very cute; I wish you both the very best of luck.
eeks. i fear for what is to become of Jesus' followers if we start questioning the validity of the scriptures to justify our lifestyles. the bible is to be taken into context as a whole, not picked apart to satisfy our own desires for who God is. so often we want God to fit into our lifestyles, when in reality, we should fit into God's plan for us.
i think digging further into the bible and your own relationship with Jesus should be a priority over any relationship you currently have.
@phoebester@xanga - Thanks for recommending my entry, And I noticed similar stance from you on the post made by soccerdad. I too have posted similar observation. Thanks again!
I'm a child from a Christian/Muslim family. I'm fine. And no blood was shed.
@PastorDan - Thanks for the honest response. I would not suggest that they abandon their religions at all. I would suggest that they honor both and in my world they can do that . I think religion hurts so many people, and while I do agree with you that there are the fiscal reponsibility issues, family issues, life issues, etc that are there and will continue to pop up I would never deny someone a chance and this is what bothers me. You are not denying them their chance but many others on here seem to be. I dont see the world the way a christian does. I was raised a christian. I have read most religious documents in the major religions and in the end they are all very very similar. If I had to choose anyone religion that I had to be in would be Buddhism. These two have a hard road, but I think too many people instantly want to tell them no. I say yes and if it fails then they both have a strong life lesson they have learned and a richer life. If it succeeds then good for them.
And I did read your sermon. It was well written and very thoughtful.
Yikes, I didn't have time to read all the comments but everyone seems kinda cut throat about all of this. I think this issue is best resolved by the author going to his pastor (or the pastor of a Bible-believing church if the current one doesn't fall into that category) and seeking out explanations to those good questions. I know there are answers but something I've noticed is that not everyone on revelife are honest experts (or sometimes they're not good communicators/teachers). Getting the theological/biblical interpretations from commenters isn't always a a safe bet.
On that note (you can take or leave my personal advice) regarding the whole Muslim/Christian relationship: dating outside of your religion (or even outside of your devotion to that religion) is risky. Regardless of where your relationship goes it never hurts to pray that she will come to know Jesus for who He really is and who He wants to be for her (personal savior, everlasting God, and Lord of her life). God does answer prayers and since it is His will that all people be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth (I Tim 2:4) I think that prayer would be one that if you're willing to back up with the action of communicating truth with her, He'd be willing to work on her heart. But its not unheard of for mismatched relationships of this sort to end with bitterness or worse with the loss of a person's honest faith in Jesus. So my opinion is don't risk it!
No one can tell you how important the issue is to you; its your decision to make and if its not that big of a deal to you that she doesn't share your faith then maybe you need to reevaluate how important your faith is to you and go from there.
Wow, most of these comments are extremely negative. I thought your story was very beautiful. It seems like the two of you are tolerant of each others' differences and are willing to compromise and explore each others' backgrounds- EVEN IF YOU DO NOT BELIEVE IN IT. My friend once had a Hanukkah party for all of us, despite none of us being Jewish. It was awesome to learn something about a different culture.
If you feel so strongly in your heart about your girlfriend, then marry her. (You know, someday, when you're both ready.) I don't think interfaith relationships are impossible, even if they are stressful and obnoxious at times.
I'm a secular agnostic nature freak that only feels at one with "the creator" when I'm in nature and I'm dating an Evangelical Christian. It's frustrating only because he doesn't understand his faith when I ask him questions about things. We may fight about it sometimes, but he's told me he wants to marry me (and I him) someday and there is nobody either of us could imagine being with.
Don't let religion tear you apart, especially if it really hasn't caused any issues so far in your relationship. You seem to have an open mind and open heart. If she's the one, then she's the one. Don't let her go.
When I read your entry today and went through the comments, it was such a blessing! I'm thankful that I got to read a very good question, and then saw a spectrum of responses more or less representing the whole community's various situations. You see, I'm new here, and reading your blog entry and the comments was what finally "tipped the scales" of decision so that I joined. I had prayed about finding an online Christian blogging community, and I think this is the one. So thank you!
I'm almost 60, but in college I was involved in a serious relationship with a Muslim. Reading the various comments about your question, I see truth in each comment. Yes, love is good, and you are in love. And also-- yes, please TRY to take a step back and look at the many difficulties that an interfaith relationship poses. If your heart is urging you to continue, it may be the Lord's hand in this, so pray. Pray a lot. Ask God to show you what you should do next. Pray WITH your girlfriend. God LOVES you both! AND God wants you both to seek Him in truth with all your hearts.
Also, study the two faith systems. You both need to be informed. Find a translation of the Bible that your girlfriend can read in her language. Find a pastor who can help you, as some of the commenters suggested.
The only comments in all of the above that I have trouble with are the ones that come from a place of fear and offer stereotypes of what her family may be like. Muslims, like other human beings, are people of many different qualities, experiences, desires, and motivations. Get to know them, and have a serious talk with your girlfriend's father (perhaps through a translator?). What are his family's expectations for their daughter, and for grandchildren. Would you be comfortable dealing with such expectations? Would her family be comfortable dealing with your own, and your own family's expectations?
May you both be blessed and grow in the love and understanding of the Lord!
So Jesus is your Lord, but you are putting your affections for your girlfriend above your affections for Christ? That's idolatry. Why would you just not trust that the Bible--that God--knows what is best for you? I just don't get it. Good luck. You know this is wrong, brother. You can read, and you know what the Bible says. It's never good to do your own thing and toss your Savior's words to the wayside. You wouldn't be in love with her if you had never considered dating her in the first place.
@iamxei@xanga - So which are you, Christian or Muslim?
@RobertLeeRE@xanga - I'm Christian, but I got there myself.