Friday, 30 October 2009

  • Why I Love Atheists

    "An atheist, like a Christian, holds that we can know whether or not there is a God. The Christian holds that we can know there is a God; the atheist, that we can know there is not." --Bertrand Russell

    I really do love atheists, you know.  Atheism, next to paganism, has to be my favorite non-Christian belief system.

    Because at the heart of it, atheists care.

    They think that it matters whether there is or isn't a God.  They think that this question is important.  And while they and I come to two very different answers to that question, we are kin in that we come to answers.  In a world that tells us "all religions and belief systems are equally valid" or "it doesn't matter what you believe, as long as you're true to it," both atheists and theists scream "It matters!"

    A prime illustration is G.K. Chesterton's little parable The Ball and the Cross, which I highly recommend.  It tells the story of Turnbull, publisher and editor of an atheistic newspaper who tries to fight against the dominant "Christian" elements of Victorian England, and yet cannot get a rise out of the general public because no-one cares enough.

    "It was in vain that he cried with an accusing energy that the Bishop of London was paid £12,000 a year for pretending to believe that the whale swallowed Jonah. It was in vain that he hung in conspicuous places the most thrilling scientific calculations about the width of the throat of a whale. Was it nothing to them all they that passed by?  ...He had said the worst thing that could be said; and it seemed accepted and ignored like the ordinary second best of the politicians. Every day his blasphemies looked more glaring, and every day the dust lay thicker upon them."

    After years of being so ignored, the first person who treats Turnbull's atheism with a "real respect and seriousness"--the first person to even read Turnbull's articles all the way through--is MacIan, a fiercely devout Catholic from the backwoods of Scotland, new to London and not yet jaded in matters of religious belief.  ("What is the good of words if they aren't important enough to quarrel over?" he asks.)  MacIan is so incensed by what he reads on the newsprint in Turnbull's window that he smashes the window, kicks his way into the office of The Atheist and challenges Turnbull to a duel, to which Turnbull enthusiastically agrees (thrilled at last to have someone who actually listens, someone who is actually angry with his ideas).

    The two men are hampered in their efforts to fight their duel, however--firstly because duels are illegal, but also because every person they encounter tries to talk them out of it. "Religion is--a--too personal a matter... The most religious people are not those who talk about it," says one.  "...You ought to be more broadminded," says another.  And (while I won't spoil the ending for you), as the two men flee from place to place throughout England searching for a quiet place to have their duel, they find that they are quite coming to like each other.

    It is that which I love about atheists.  They think that these questions of reality or existence are worth fighting for, worth arguing over.  They think that it matters whether God is or is not.

    Those who tell me that every religion/belief system is the same, or that every religion/belief system is just as good as the others, are making a value claim.  Because if it is true that all religions and belief systems are equally valid, it would only be true if they were equally worthless, equally meaningless.  When one belief claims that the Good is found by detaching oneself from the needs and desires of the body, and another belief claims that the Good is found by plunging in and changing the world for the better, and another belief claims that the Good is found by isolating oneself from other people, how can they all be true?  When one claims that God is pleased if we behave and follow his laws, and another claims that God is pleased if we admit that we haven't behaved and throw ourselves on his mercy, and another claims that God doesn't really care what we do, and another claims that God doesn't exist and we shouldn't be fixated on pleasing a nonexistent figment at the expense of humanity--how can these all be true?  If all belief systems are equally valid, equally true, then "true" means little more than "what makes me happy."  (And that in and of itself is a truth-claim.)  If each religion and belief system is only as good as all the others, then they are meaningless, and the question of whether there is or is not such a thing as a god (and what God/gods are like if there is) simply isn't important enough to bother over.

    But Atheism says, "God/gods/deity do not exist."  It makes a clear statement regarding the validity of other belief structures; it uncategorically states that belief structures which contradict its own are wrong, because the universe cannot be contradictory (God cannot exist and not-exist at the same time).  And by making such a claim, it places importance on the issue: the question of whether there is such a thing as a deity not only can be answered, but should.

    So while I disagree with their answer, I love atheists for answering.  I respect and admire their stance.  Because, in answering, they acknowledge the importance of the question--which is far more than most people do.

    What are your thoughts on atheists? Does this post change your opinions  ?

Comments (42)

  • paper_swords@xanga

    good post. i am an Athiest, but i did enjoy reading that. The world would be boring if we all had the same point of view, its healthy to dissagree occasioanlly i think

  • xsimplepleasuresx@xanga

    Neither athiesm nor theism are about knowledge, they are about belief.  Their beliefs dictates their perception of knowledge of the existance of god.  Regardless, thanks for the love.

  • Ex_Adyto_Cordis@xanga
    Which is why I consider myself an agnostic atheist before anyone can label me an "atheist." I don't believe in anything supernatural including a god, not because I claim to know for certain there is no god but because there is no scientific evidence verifying or disproving it. I don't believe in god but I don't claim that there is without a doubt no god.
  • MsKittyCatty@xanga

    Great post!


    I find atheists to be normal people. Some are wonderful, some are not. It's the same with Christians... or any other belief system's followers for that matter. Respect is always key to me.

  • salvatruca_stalking_havok13@xanga

    Life would be pretty pointless if we all believed the same thing. It's fun having a friendly debate once in a while. Now if we could all learn to respect each other, that would be just great. 

  • Cycl0p5@xanga

    I used to consider myself a Christian for the longest time, and some of my best friends were Atheists.  Great people, for the most part.  (Basically, goes to show you can't judge someone on their faith).  That said, understanding the importance of the question is ironically what has led me away from Christianity  (not that I think it's WRONG...just that circumstances have broken my conviction that it's necessarily RIGHT.)

    Great post, btw.

  • GodlessLiberal@xanga

    Thanks for keeping an open mind on us heathens.

  • LoBornlyte@xanga

    Because at the heart of it, atheists care


    Intentions mean absolutely nothing.  Results are what count.


    Atheists are human beings and deserve love.  But the philosophy of atheism is abhorent and needs to be removed from the face of the earth like a malignant cancer.


    Cancer matastacizes and so does atheism.  Nihilistic philosophies like atheism need to be annihilated before they lead mankind to destruction.


    So while I disagree with their answer, I love atheists for answering. 


    Does the OP admire serial killers, pimps, drug pushers and terrorists?  They too have answers.

  • hubbaduh@xanga

    Do you naively believe that agnostics don't think it matters what you believe?

  • transvestite_rabbit@xanga

    I love LoBornlyte, because her comments always remind me what religion is really all about.

  • modernmelody

    I really enjoy this post.  I'm a Christian, but I have a lot of agnostic and atheist friends for whom I have a lot of respect.  It's great to hear that I'm not the only one who has respect for them, regardless of what they believe.  After all, it was love and respect--not judgment and criticism--that won a lot of us converts to Christianity over in the first place.  That's what got me, anyway.

  • deepestrecesses

    I respect the atheist that realizes my attempt to share the one and only thing I love in this world with them is not an attempt to offend them.  I also respect their choice regarding acceptance or rejection of what composes the core of my life. 


    For the atheist that can't see this and takes offense, I guess I have very little in common with them and am more than happy to leave them be.   

  • IsaacClarke@xanga

    Thanks for the compliment. I do find that in some respects I have more in common with conservative Christians than with religious liberals. Yes, it does matter what you believe, and yes it does matter that you get it right. Beliefs affect your actions, which affect others, so they are not entirely a private concern. To argue over these matters is not vain, and not pointless discord.

  • theworldiswatchingyou@xanga

    I don't have much of an opinion about people before I interact with them.  I have found just as many Christians as atheists who I disliked.  But your post was very thought provoking, and I agree that it is refreshing to find people who are still passionate, still alive, and not sleeping through life but actively seeing answers to tough questions.  And that story sounds like a good one (I do like Chesterton).

  • monobeam@xanga

    I don't want to sound mean, but revelife spends lots of time talking about things other than God, Christianity... in other words, outside of it's stated subject.  This is like atheists talking about God -- they are outside their material world and its content if they make statements about God.

  • anonymous

    Great post, agnostic here btw. 

  • anonymous

    Comes close to "Be ye either hot or cold"; don't you think?

  • anonymous

    Anyone needs to see the animated movie "The Laws of Eternity"
    Though I don't agree with everything, it has plenty of views.

  • stephenandginny@xanga

    @transvestite_rabbit@xanga - Yeah. I mean, if you can find just one religious person with whom you disagree (and that's certainly easy enough), then you can just ignore all other religious people, painting them with the same brush, even if they disagree with the same person you do.

    @LoBornlyte@xanga - You prefer apathy to thoughtful dissidence?

    You can't annihilate atheism without banning free thought, which, of course, would be impossible, or, if somehow possible, tragic. You can't love atheists and simultaneously, coercively purge them of their beliefs.

  • transvestite_rabbit@xanga

    @stephenandginny@xanga - It's more like a continuum along the same brush.

  • stephenandginny@xanga
  • LoBornlyte@xanga

    @stephenandginny@xanga - You can't annihilate atheism without banning free thought, which, of course, would be impossible, or, if somehow possible, tragic.


    I am referring to a pyrotechnic, neverending display of the Gospel.  The early Christians converted the entire Greek world.

  • pheorbs@xanga

    wonderful post, it's always great to see people able to be mature enough to share difference of opinions and understand why that in itself is important.

    Of course I am more of the persuasion that you pointed out already. Religion is about making people personally happy in my opinion. It doesn't make it less valid or less meaningful, it creates something a person needs in their life. And in some cases being a follower and having a leader is necessary to some.

    Unfortunately I think there are just as many religious exploiters as there are believers and that often leads to some of the anger, misunderstanding and problems that happen when differing minds come across each other.

  • gottobereal64@xanga

    @LoBornlyte@xanga - Wow.  How is atheism a threat to anyone?  If a person's faith is not strong enough to withstand questioning, that is not the fault of the athiest. 

  • LoBornlyte@xanga

    @gottobereal64@xanga - How is atheism a threat to anyone? 


    Atheism is a threat because it stunts the intellect and appeals to people who think they are smarter and better than anyone else.


    Also atheism is devoid of morality, and is a philosophy of denial.  Amorality and denial are psychopathologies not avenues to rational thought. 


    Atheists err in thinking they are rational.  By denying the Creator they deny reason and goodness.


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