Saturday, 05 September 2009

  • On (Not) Saving Souls

    on (not) saving souls My supervisor and I were at a volunteer fair which was held at a local Christian college yesterday. She got hardcore Evangelized to, not by a student but by a representative from a local church. (Incidentally, I briefly attended this church about two years ago.) This guy was persistent even though she politely made it clear that she wasn’t interested in engaging in that particular conversation. He apparently has no clue how to read his audience. Somehow I escaped his “do you know where you’re going when you die” questioning by pretending to be excessively absorbed in observing and talking to students.

    The incident has been on my mind ever since. I think it really rubbed me the wrong way because it was all too… familiar. Every technique he used, everything he said—it was all stuff I’ve been taught. In my youth-group days I was “trained” in that form of saving souls.

    I am not a big fan of Evangelism in general, and particularly this form. It’s never sat well with me for a variety of reasons. My main objection, though, is that I don’t think it works. What makes you think you can genuinely “win” and “save” a stranger via five-minute interrogation and challenging? How does that interaction represent God’s character, the whole of Christian theology, the relational love that is central to the message of the faith? Pretending that it works is truly offensive to me. It underestimates a person’s intelligence and autonomy and it maligns theology, as well.

    I know that guy’s deal all too well. He’ll probably go back to his community and talk about how the experience changed his life and hers, when in reality it changed neither. He was never truly open to understanding her words or heart. He just wanted to add a tally mark in the “souls I’ve saved” column. I’ve been there, done that, and I know his type all too well. He said that he’s been a Christian for 1 ½ years and is now in training to be a pastor. Eighteen months? I guess I admire your zeal, guy, and perhaps your heart is in the right place… but you have no clue yet. You have no idea what it’s like to be tired of the faith, burned out on organized religion, hurt and confused and struggling all the while to live a life you’re not sure you believe in anymore. You have no idea. And since you don’t listen, you’ll never get it. And you’ll never pull a burned-out and disenfranchised soul back into the church unless you get it. We’re not really swayed by the standard speech. We’ve heard it before. Heck, we’ve given it before.

    Being trained in this form of Evangelism never, ever sat well with me. I was always uncomfortable with the assumptions it forces one to make about other people, skeptical about the competition to save souls, doubtful about the use of theology to exalt such a practice. For many years I assumed I was the problem: I felt uncomfortable about Evangelizing because I was bad at it, because I didn’t truly challenge myself, because I didn’t love Jesus enough. Now I see differently. I didn’t fail because I didn’t save any strangers on the sidewalk I’m not the issue. Evangelical Christianity is.

    People wonder why I got sick of the church; this is one big reason why. Shaky theology was used to make me believe that there was something wrong with me when I didn’t want to go along with what the youth group was doing. (The same was true of not voting as a single-issue-pro-life Republican, or believing homosexuality is a sin, among other things.) I got sick of the church because I learned to trust my own thinking and stop believing unquestioningly in the ideas of other imperfect people. I rejected the teachings that never, ever rang true with me in the first place. And until I did, I regrettably hurt other people and hurt my own sense of self.

    Am I still wounded and bitter? Absolutely! Is there room for me elsewhere in Christianity? Perhaps someday. Am I ready to consider it now? Not quite… so don’t go trying to save my soul. The church already tried that, and look where it got me.

    What do you think is the problem with Evangelism? Why does it work/not work?

Comments (32)

  • SerenaDante@xanga

    Because people who attempt to evangelize have been known - as you've shown here - not to take "NO! for an answer. So everyone gets sick of them super quickly.

  • too_pretty_to_die@xanga

    loved this post.  i know exactly how you feel... there are many things i can accept about Christianity, but many things i can't. 

    to me, evangelizing works only with one principle: the Christian wants to show the non-Christian why he/she is wrong.  Christians who do that can rarely demonstrate why, in turn, they are right.  because Christians operate in a "one true faith" mindset, it seems like they believe that all people think like that... and that all they need to do is show them the flaws in non-Christian belief.  as an agnostic, i'm already open to the idea that i may have it wrong.  telling me i may go to Hell doesn't mean much.  i'm not going to accept faith out of fear. 

  • cornerstonechwk

    I honestly wonder if you ever saw yourself as a wretched sinner in the first place. I'ts entirely possible that you had a false conversion. Surely you can't blame the church for your condition!


    When you say that form of evangelism doesn't work, are you saying no one has ever become a Christian when approached that way?

  • AnchoressNun@xanga

    Simply; are you not capable of taking a New Testament to a  quiet place and reading and listening, and making your own mind up?


    Faith is between yourself and Jesus.


    He is there; He is alive. why listen to any other voice? Just read, listen and let Him speak to you. 


    Blessings from Ireland.

  • subSacred@xanga

    Is there room for me elsewhere in Christianity? Perhaps someday. Am I
    ready to consider it now? Not quite… so don’t go trying to save my
    soul. The church already tried that, and look where it got me.


    The Church can not save your soul. Jesus can. I think a lot of "evangelizers" forget that.And apparently, you were never aware of that.

    Jesus does call His followers to share the Gospel with all people, the problem is so many Christians have turned it into a numbers game, competition, or some kind of art form. The Biblical model is to share the truth of the Gospel, and move on... unless there is a positive response. If someone doesn't want to hear it, there's no scriptural example or support for hounding, harassing or begging. If someone is willing to talk to you about it, but still firmly disagrees, there is no Biblical support for insisting that they agree, agitating the situation, or trying to argue Jesus into their hearts.

    Our job is to share the truth with those who are willing to hear, it is up to them to listen and respond. If they don't, they don't. Move on. If it is someone you don't really know, don't try to fake wanting a friendship with them just so that you hopefully get more chances to witness. And if it is a person you actually have a relationship with, find ways to continue that relationship without repeatedly slamming them with your faith, because you've already shared it quite clearly.

  • mathematicalbagpiper@xanga

    I applaud your perspective. As I said in a blog post I wrote not too long ago, when I tell you I'm not interested I mean absolutely nothing personal by it. To be fair, most people of your ilk are just fine to say "OK, thank you for your time" and move on. However, the very vocal minority is who REALLY gets my goat. It's those that think they have to save everyone (and you know if you're one of them, I know there are those that are like that on Xanga too!!!) that drive me batty. I've had to use physical force a time or two to get them to leave me alone. 


    I have Christian friends. They feel no need to discuss religion with me because they know what my response will be. Those that have to bring religion into everything just don't find their way into my circle of friends. I don't want to deal with the drama. 
  • Roadkill_Spatula@xanga

    I have always felt uncomfortable "doing evangelism", but not talking about God to people if it was natural in the conversation. Becky Pippert's book "Out of the Saltshaker" was very encouraging. Not at all about a canned spiel, but about real relationships.


    There are a few people out there who have an evangelism gift. They seem to lead people to the Lord without being uncomfortable or making others uncomfortable. But I've only known a few.

  • anonymous

    Jesus' message did not center on where you were going when you died, nor was his main emphasis on "saving souls". He came to demonstrate that he was the way to a relationship with his Father which was the key to really living, now and forever. He made friends with sinners because he cared about them whether or not they received his message. If Christians would lift him up by the way they lived and loved, those who don't know him would be drawn to him.


    Unfortunately, Christianity has become a religion rather than the expression of a relationship with God and one another. Religion breeds shame and performance based motivation which drives its adherents to "witness" among other perceived imperatives from a sense of religious obligation. The focus tends to be on doing rather than being. Of course doing is important, Jesus did more than anyone else, but if it doesn't flow naturally from being like him, it's simply dead works.

  • Brandon_thewriter@xanga

    So, are you still a follower of Jesus to this day, or are you on the outskirts?

  • sheepthatsblack@xanga

    My sentiment exactly...thank you!

    I've been trained with these questions, been given these tracts and guides, poured through them....and then after having my intelligence insulted and not finding a single point of interesting evidence or any reason more than a guilt trip I politely crumpled them up and threw them in the general direction of my trash can where they remained on the floor for a month or two until I did the same thing all over again (except I would usually set it in the trash rather than repeat this in another month). I have yet to find a tract with any sort of intelligent basis...just guilt tripping and fear mongering.

    That's why I befriend people rather than go on various outreach and evangelism surges...

  • ellicepark@xanga

    youll make your way.
    since the church ,made of people , didn't work.
    have you ever tried reading the text for itself?
    outside boundaries of what everyone else says--both
    the conservatives and liberals--
    whatever your definition of those two are...?

  • DixieD@xanga

    My problem with all this is:  how exactly do you know my soul needs to be saved?  What if my soul is perfectly okay just the way it is?  I'm a Christian, and I'm not evangelizing.  Instead, I prefer to teach my children to love God, and make sure my actions reflect that wherever.  If I'm asked what I believe, I certainly will tell of my beliefs.  But in the meantime, I prefer to take Jesus's word to heart and worship God in private, not out loud "like the hypocrits do."  

  • Jedi_Master_713@xanga

    I love discussions about religion in which everyone is willing to learn something from another person.  The reason why the type of evangelism you've described bothers me is because it turns into a one-way sermon instead of a conversation.


    Thanks for posting and all the best!

  • pamilvr@xanga

    propagation of heartfelt thought like this and time loving and serving others -


    - that may be the only way to "do it"...

  • ANVRSADDAY@xanga

    Some things just take time. In time, you will decide what is right for you. I waited until I was 30. My wife 28. We moved 20 times in 40 years and always went to church. We saw lots of churches. A few were great, some average, and too many awful. Just based on our experience, while going to church is encouraged, it is a sometimes very difficult endeavor for  reasons you have stated. More people used to go to church than go--that is my opinion.  Anyway, I wish you well.

  • naphtali_deer@xanga

    @David Fredrickson -  You wrote:

    He [Jesus] came to demonstrate that he was the way to a relationship with his Father which was the key to really living...

    I agree with that. Only as Christ's Spirit dwells in us can we live the life Jesus modeled and taught about in the Beatitudes.

    However I have disagree with the following:

    Jesus' message did not center on where you were going when you died, nor was his main emphasis on "saving souls".

    Jesus did talk about hell, weeping and gnashing of teeth. He said He came to seek and save what was lost and whoever does not believe in Him is condemned already. Jesus told us that the Father sent Him into the world that whoever believes in Him might be saved. Unless someone is saved they never can never enter into the relationship with the Father about which you speak.

    I do agree that as we speak of Christ with people we should be loving and respectful, but at the same time there should be a sense of urgency. We can have that right balance when we understand someone's salvation does not rest w/ us but with the work of God in their life. We present the Gospel keeping in mind that God alone is the one who can bring life to dead souls.

  • Ulma@xanga

    @cornerstonechwk - Don't you think it'd be wrong to convert to Christianity just because someone either brainwashes you, or scares you into believing that if you don't you'll go to hell. 

  • stillooking2find@xanga

    I'm sorry about your obvious bitterness.  I'm sure the heart of the Lord is grieved that people have treated you in such a way that this has occurred.  One of our former pastors said "The Church is the light of the world, and, like any light, it draws bugs."  While that is funny, it also is true and sad. 

    I hope the our Benevolently Sovereign God will wrap His arms around you today and make His love, mercy and grace very real to you today.

  • cornerstonechwk

    @Ulma@xanga -  While I do believe a person should have a healthy fear of hell, I don't think it should be what motivates them to become a Christian. I believe a person should see him or herself in the light of Gods moral law in order to see themselves the way God sees them. Once they understand that God would be good and just to send them to hell, they can then see the cross in it's true light, and how amazingly kind and merciful God is to send a savior to take their punishment for them. The Lord knows my mind sure needed and needs washing.

  • Ulma@xanga

    @cornerstonechwk - Sorry, I find your blind faith terrifying.
    God is a cruel monster because if he created the world then he created evil blah blah blah.

    P.s Brainwashing is a NEGATIVE thing. People should think for themselves.

  • cornerstonechwk

    @Ulma@xanga - Sorry but my faith is not blind, it's founded upon facts! Yes you are evil, but God can change that.

  • Ulma@xanga

    @cornerstonechwk - I am evil?! Are you kidding me?
    What facts if I may ask? 

  • mathematicalbagpiper@xanga

    @Ulma@xanga - I'll answer that one for you...the "fact" that earth is 6,000 years old.

  • Ulma@xanga

    @abilene_piper_lg@xanga - how does that answer the belief reality? (or were you joking? :) )

  • mathematicalbagpiper@xanga

    @Ulma@xanga - I was being highly facetious. I'm an atheist. LOL. 

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