Dear Revelife and all your contributors,
You are the reason people have a negative view of Christianity. For every post on tolerance and love you have three talking about how doctrine X is wrong or how terrible a certain type of non-Christian is. Despite your dozens of guest writers, you profess only one form of Christianity, and that's right-wing fundamentalist protestant. Of course, once in awhile you'll post something about how it's OK to be gay and Christian, or allow someone like myself to question a tenant of your dogma.
Of course, you couldn't
possibly post something written by an open atheist without editing it first, could you? Every single entry of mine you've put up you edited in some way. When I shared a story about meeting a girl who was disowned by her family, I wrote it in a particular way to give it a particular tone to get a particular message across. So what do you do?
You change the title, you throw in a picture of some random girl in a hospital bed, and you felt the urge to discard what I considered a poignant message to add some inane question about prayer versus medicine.
When I shared
my story about how I became an atheist, you for some reason threw in a picture of a lone person walking in the middle of the desert, as if I was all alone without God in my life. And the best part was, you deleted several comments left on this post... comments left by me. These comments contained no profanity, didn't insult a single person and actually elucidated some of my points. Yet you felt that your site needed to be censored by this display of... what, exactly? Logic? Decency? Respect? Dissent? I've seen dozens of comments left on your site talking about "homos," "queers," and "fags," yet these don't get deleted.
And then there was my post where I listed a dozen questions you should ask yourself if you took the bible literally.
Revelife boiled it down to a single question, and of course it was one of the more inane of the bunch. And when I first posted it on my own site, I accidentally used the term "ineffable" instead of "infallible," which I immediately changed. This change would have been in the submitted form Revelife got, but instead they decided to ignore my own edits (which I made within five minutes of making the original post public) and instead go through with theirs.
Then, Revelife, there are your commenters. You want to know why people have such a negative image of Christians? It's because of a very vocal subset of your commenters. If I had a dollar for every time I was addressed using one of the classical logical fallacies (attacking the person not the argument, setting up a strawman, red herrings, or just plain ignoring the subject at hand) I could help get the government out of the recession.
I'm sick of people whining about dissenting opinions popping up on Revelife. If you want nothing but sycophantic agreement with your preconceived ideals, start up a blog through your church and limit the membership. Because God (or any other deity) forbid you actually have to listen to something that may, for one iota, make you think outside your cozy little conception of the world. What's the worst thing that could happen? You could realize that I have a valid point, and your worldview might be shaken. But wouldn't that be a good thing? Shouldn't we all be searching for the truth, wherever it leads us?
If you suddenly see a valid argument against creationism, maybe that means instead of donning your earmuffs and singing "That Old Time Religion" at the top of your lungs you should put on your thinking cap and consider that maybe, just maybe, there's something to this "science" thing you've been hearing so much about. What are you really worried about here?
It seems like some of you are worried that if you learn too much you'll fall out of your faith. Do you think your creator gave you a brain and expected you not to use it? That he/she/it/they wanted you to remain ignorant to the facts of the world? That sounds less like any sort of deity I'd want to worship and a lot more like a fascist ruler, a Mussolini or a Kim Jung-Il.
So seriously people, try considering that atheists are people too, just like homosexuals, Muslims, feminists, anyone who is pro-choice, Democrats, and basically anyone else who you use the phrase "love the sinner, hate the sin" about. Open your eyes and ears to new ideas and concepts, even if they seem strange, frightening and even possibly a bit blasphemous. Because what would be better, protecting yourself from the truth and living a lie, or learning what the world really is like and formatting your life to that?
True
Comments (390)
100% WIN.
I've been waiting for this to get posted.
Cheers yet again,
Taylor
I see your point, but I must ask, why should RevLife post about why you became an atheist at all? I mean, it's supposed to be a religious site, and Christian. I don't think you go to church with the intent of enlightening Christians who you think are judgmental and ignorant., so why do it online? You are trying to get into an exclusively Christian site and then complaining that they don't want your blatantly anti-Christian views. And speaking of logical fallacies, you really seem to be stereotyping us. I don't go trolling on atheist or pro-gay boards, and I don't think most Christians do. Discussion is good, but anyone who wants to write on the pro-gay agenda or anything similar has a thousand other places to go where they can state their views without the intent of making others mad. Maybe Xanga needs an AthLife, but that's up to them.
[Note: This comment was originally posted on godlessliberal's site, but I thought I'd post it here, too.]
I have many of the same complaints you do. I visit Revelife regularly, just because I want to hear about Christianity from Christians. (I figure it's unfair to only listen to atheists talk about Christians, the same way it's unfair to only listen to religious people talk about atheists, so I want to hear different opinions.) I've never had a post on Revelife, but I would be upset too if they edited it in such a way that changed the meaning or weakened the argument.
Concerning the "love the sinner, hate the sin" idea, I find it amazing, how so many of the "nicer" posts about homosexuality, people of other religions, etc. the attitude seems to be something along the lines of the following: They're going to hell, but let's tell them that nicely so they'll be convinced to convert. (It's not said in those words exactly, but that seems to be the theme or general idea.) There's rarely a post saying that homosexuality, being a part of a different religion, etc. is perfectly okay. I know there are Christians with many different opinions about various topics, but it seems the overwhelming majority of the posts are expressing a similar point of view. I can kind of understand that Christians who don't share these views would feel they are being misrepresented.
@SerenaDante@xanga - Agreed.
FLAWLESS VICTORY
@SerenaDante@xanga - You forgot a few zeros on that.
Despite your dozens of guest writers, you profess only one form of Christianity, and that's right-wing fundamentalist protestant.
I am Catholic and I have had two of my articles published. The dirth of other outlooks is probably because they just don't post to Revelife.
If anything Revelife is like a tower of Babel. So many differing takes on Christianity by Christians. I think that is the real tragedy. Jesus wanted his disciples to be unified. Without unity the voice of Christianity is lost in the hubbub of worldly incoherence.
This post is full of win and victory.
Not so sure if I agree with this. And I am very critical of Christianity.
Another lament by a God-hating cry baby. If this weren't a Christian forum I might be able to squeeze out at least one piddly crocodile tear.
Anyone who wants to go to a loving atheist site can go here. Go here and you will see how this jewel of a human being takes our Revelife comments and subjects them to merciless ridicule.
I suggest that the OP would spend his time better by going to a porn site, grabbing his private parts in just the right way, and continue on to do what he does best.
So much trouble.. over what is essentially a fuzzy feeling.
I have a great sadness for this species.
Well unfortunately there's going to be trolls commenting on every post on Xanga...and doesn't every Ish site reserve the right to edit people's post? I highly doubt that's just a feature unique to Revelife alone.
@LoBornlite@xanga - Although I would probably say it another way, I think I might agree with you.
I understand where the poster is coming from, but I think sometimes people forget that this is supposed to be a Christian community. So when people write posts from the opposite side, they should be happy that it was even posted at all. I'm not mad at said people or anything, but why complain? They should appreciate the amount of freedom, even if there are some limitations, that the editors give them on a Christian blogging site when they're posting the stuff that they do.
Just to let you know, I am a Christian who does value thinking and is striving to love God with my mind. Its not all Christians who think the way you stated or even the ones you've read in the comments. However, I've had much the same complaint with Revelife and even stopped reading for quite some time due to the "profess[ion of] only one form of Christianity, and that's right-wing fundamentalist..."
@railfan@xanga - second that.
godless liberal, i feel your plea. cos it's a rather good one--in terms of WHY BOTCH UP THE ORIGINAL WORDS. right? if they aren't going to like everything on your post... they shouldn't post it up at all. right? so i feel that your plea really roots with the whole: why compromise??
meaning to say.. why compromise revelife's faith, and why compromise your post. revelife should post christian posts with christian views, allow people to comment regardless of their faith.. since it is an internet forum and anything internet is somewhat universal (90s ads for internet, you know?). so yeah, there's a double agenda here, it seems.. or just a failure of adherence to revelife's purpose.
epic win.
I completely agree. And to those who are complaining about revelife publishing content that is not 100% about Christianity, well, um, Jesus ate with sinners, did he not? And if Revelife chooses to publish something, shouldn't it at least not be riddled with a thousand edits that take away from the original author's message? I find this happening on other sites like autisable and momaroo as well, so it's not only Revelife that is doing so.
Oh shoot. Godless Liberal on Revelife? Haha!
Your words wound me! Granted, the prevailing topics and work on this site are usually less... philosophically and theologically rigorous than I'd like, but I'd hoped that people would pick that up from my posts. When I do write, however, there are usually crickets chirping in the comment-sparse background. I think controversial posts definitely do draw more attention and trolls, but there are a number of solid ones (controversial and otherwise) out there.
As for the editing... well, I've kinda gotten used to that. My posts get the same treatment (I don't think a single one has been un-edited): pictures added, titles & endings/questions changed, and other little surprises that I don't always find pleasant, but I generally don't complain. That said, I loved your post about your friend who had surgery in its original format (on the voting site) and was surprised & disappointed with its edited form. Generally though, if you specifically request not to have things changed, the editors are pretty good with honoring that.
Comments, however, are another and fuzzier matter. It's harder for me to see where that editing occurs (since I never get to read it in the first place!), so I must say I'm very surprised and sad to hear that. In the early days of Revelife, censorship was used fairly rarely and only for explicit or highly derogatory posts that hurt people, but now you make it sound like the content itself is being moderated, which I also do not agree with.
That said, Revelife does possess the fundamental right and responsibility to moderate its own posts and comments, as much as any of us would like to disagree. This is because it exists for a specific purpose and community. A power walking discussion board may entertain the occasional article from someone (such as myself) who doesn't believe it should be classified as an Olympic sport, but it is under no compulsion or even responsibility to honor their requests or commentary. If Revelife were a general religious group, such criticism may be warranted, but it always has been (and I hope will continue to be) explicitly Christian.
THAT said, I still agree with you that content censorship and a bias towards inflammatory or self-congratulatory posts is counter-productive to the original purposes of the community... but c'est la vie.
Atheists have the right to start an atheist site, and so do Christians. Any member of any group can start one. I can't understand why atheists get their shorts in a bunch when Christians disagree with them?
I'm glad they posted this!
I'm glad to see this on revelife.
To those that say atheists shouldn't be allowed on revelife- do you allow nonchristians to attend your churches?
First, saying that Revelife and its contributors are the reasons people have a negative view of Christianity is sort of like saying Wikipedia is the reason why people have a negative view of information or gangster rap is why people don't like blacks. Its ridiculous.
Contrary to what you have selectively observed, there is a surprising variety of Christian and non Christian perspective shared here. I think your problem is you want one of these Christian perspectives to affirm atheism, which of course won't happen. This is a Christian site, so don't get pissy if the overwhelming majority have some sort of perspective that doesn't agree with atheism. And don't get pissy if the editors decide to keep a Christian theme at the forefront.
Now as far as editing and censorship, this is not at all unique to the Christian world. It happens all the time on sites of all kinds to save space and time. But it sounds like it is possible that some of your posts and comments have been edited a bit too much, and that isn't fair. I have not seen what they edited so I can't say for sure, all I know is people get away with saying some obscene blasphemous stuff on here, so I am curious to see what got cut.
Still, don't go attacking Revelife as if it the final authority on all things Christian. Expand your horizons. If you don't like the site, don't come here. Christianity exists elsewhere, online and offline. And if you just don't like Christians, leave them alone.
@Jedi_Master_713@xanga -
"Concerning the "love the sinner, hate
the sin" idea, I find it amazing, how so many of the "nicer" posts
about homosexuality, people of other religions, etc. the attitude seems
to be something along the lines of the following: They're going to hell, but let's tell them that nicely so they'll be convinced to convert.
(It's not said in those words exactly, but that seems to be the theme
or general idea.) There's rarely a post saying that homosexuality,
being a part of a different religion, etc. is perfectly okay."
And? There are many different flavors and slants to Christianity, but generally speaking traditional Christianity is about converting people to Christianity and not about telling everybody that its perfectly okay to not be a Christian. Sounds like you have heard an accurate Christian message from Christians, and you are waiting to hear it change. In my opinion, if it changed to the "all religions lead to heaven" deal you are looking for, it would not be Christianity, so its not really Christianity you are interested in.
As far as homosexuality, I am one who has bounced back and forth on the idea of whether or not it is sin, and I have also seen openness to such ideas expressed quite clearly by others here as well, but not that often. But in any case, understand... love the sinner hate the sin doesn't mean that we don't speak out against sin. Love tells someone when they are doing something wrong, and most of those on Revelife who speak against homosexuality, whether they are right or wrong in their views, are doing it out of love and concern for mankind.
You know, this letter didn't annoy me when I read it on GL's site, but I find myself annoyed by the fifteen "EPIC WIN" and "VICTORY" comments that follow it now. I mean, the purpose of that is...? Commenters, I can understand cheerleading, but can't we at least get a little more contribution than that? What do you agree with, specifically about GL's post?
As they stand now, these comments are little better than people drawing battle lines in the sand--and battle lines aren't all that great for communication/conversation. And communication/conversation is, unless I'm majorly misreading it, what GL's post is about.
@subSacred@xanga - "most of those on Revelife who speak against
homosexuality, whether they are right or wrong in their views, are
doing it out of love and concern for mankind."
I'm not sure about that.