Sunday, 02 August 2009
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I Will NOT Speak to You If Your Christianity is Different
I see so many people having problems with one another because of their Christian beliefs. So you're a Catholic? Oh man, then you have never really met Jesus. So you're a Christian Pentecostal? Oh, you must exaggerate when you go to church. I am honestly so done with hearing at my church that if you're not a certain type of Christian, then you are not saved and probably gonna go burn in the pot of flames.Let's get some common sense people, from the man upstairs: In Mark 9:38-41, the apostles stopped a man that was driving out demons in Jesus' name, with the excuse that he wasn't "one of them." Jesus replied, "Do not stop him. No one who does a miracle in my name can in the next moment say anything bad about me, for whoever is not against us is for us. I tell you the truth, anyone who gives you a cup of water in my name because you belong to Christ, will certainly not lose his reward." Doesn't that tell you a lot of things?
It made me realize that my pastor has no right to talk about any other religion that is under Christianity and point fingers saying, "Oh, you've never met Christ." How in the world can someone tell you that if you are a person who goes to church every Sunday, are involved in your church, and try to live your life according to the Bible as much as possible that you "are not a real believer."
I am pretty angry and upset at my pastor for not only that, but telling me that the way Catholics baptized people is wrong also. He referred to it as "sprinkling water and have a fancy party after." How can in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, be sprinkling water? Yes, I understand parents in a Catholic church tend to baptize their children at a very young age. But that gives him no right to call Catholics unbelievers and not real followers.
There is and will continue to be fake people in every type of Christian church. It's divided into 3 categories: the believers, the ones who want to believe, and the unbelievers. I think that everyone who believes with all their heart and soul that Jesus is their savior and trusts him automatically becomes a member in the God's family. If you refuse to emphasize differences and instead emphasize commitment in Christ, it would be much easier to feel comfortable with other Christian groups.
We are all made different, but if we believe in the same God, in the same bible, and keep ourselves on track, what is the big deal? Why do people want to keep on fighting and arguing? Read the Bible instead and learn from Jesus' steps; he's the truth, the light, and he will show you the right way of living.
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Comments (98)
Mmmk. I hate how my friend's friend thinks she most catholic person ever, and she can school you about god. No, you don't. Espcially when you're 11.
I might not go to church a lot, but I do believe theres a god, jesus, heavan and hell. I pray daily too.
Awesome post. I totally agree with you here, it makes me so mad when some Christians I know blast other people of the SAME FAITH but different denominations or traditions and tell them they are going to hell. Being saved is based on your personal relationship with Jesus Christ, not how you baptize someone or what songs you sing.
Thank you for this post, a lot of people need to hear it.
Interesting post. Good points on unity within the church (meaning Believers, not denominations).
The Catholic vs. Protestant issue is a tough one. We have extreme theological disagreements with one another, much more so then say Baptists vs. Presbyterians. However, these disagreements can be useful if they lead to a healthy discourse of Christian doctrine and even vigorous debate. I think the problem comes in when people question the motivations of Believers in different churches. There simply is no way to look into someone's soul and measure their love of or commitment to Christ.
My conclusion: healthy, even vigorous debate, yes; questioning personal sincerity: no.
same fear tactics.
Interesting post
Yeah, it is bullshit, and in large part is why I'm no longer Christian. That's a nice verse, but I guarantee you that there's another one somewhere that says/implies the exact opposite message.
Our job as believers is to point out false doctrine and teachings, not to judge the eternal destination of others. I have theological differences with a number of denominations. Some I can overlook (i.e. Calvinism/Arminianism, the role of women, baptism methods) while others I feel are important enough to condemn (salvation apart from Christ, denial of hell, salvation by works, etc.) Whether believing the latter will keep someone from heaven, I don't know. Thankfully it's not my job to figure that out. However I will speak out against some beliefs and encourage other believers not to be involved with groups that teach things contrary to the gospel.
@Soul_Pizza@xanga - Don't you think that's an illogical reason to not be a Christian? Shouldn't our acceptance or rejection of Christianity depend on the truth claims of Jesus, rather than the actions of his followers? It's like me refusing to vote for Obama because my neighbors all like him and they're a bunch of jerks.
A fantastic post. There is far too much of this pointless criticism in the world today. I think it's human nature to be diverse in our beliefs. Thinking that your personal faith is the only way to believe simply closes you off to what Jesus was really trying to say.
As for Catholic baptism, it is more than just sprinkling water and having a fancy party. The whole point of the ceremony is to welcome the child into Gods family. The fancy party bit is because the family want to celebrate this milestone in their childs life. It's certainly not an official part of the sacrament.
Christian in-fighting helped me see the flaws of the religion more clearly. i've never understood how a religion that claims to be the one true faith can have so many different groups claiming superiority. seems to me that if Christianity is the ultimate belief system, the Christian god would have been more clear about such important theological matters.
truth. being a christian should mean being CHRIST like. the bible clearly defines who christ is. there is be no debate. end of story.
@Theophilus166@xanga - That's not the ONLY reason by far, but it's a huge contributing factor. But let me put it this way; why is the Bible more divisive than unifying? Every time I ask, I get the "Well, we're all unified through Christ, and nothing else matters" answer, but, obviously a LOT of other stuff matters or we wouldn't constantly be fighting over which denomination is "right," "true," "real," etc.
But if you want to talk about the truth claims of Jesus, I can go there too. Look up how many different times someone asked Jesus how to get into Heaven, and then note how every time he gives a different answer and claims "this is all you have to do." Confusing much? Yeah... Quite.
And on that note, one of his answers was something along the lines of "give away all of your belongings, give all of your money to the poor, and follow me." How many Christians have done that; given everything - not almost everything, not even most of what they have, but EVERYTHING - and followed Jesus? Seems to me that Heaven will be pretty empty...
"I am pretty angry and upset at my pastor for not only that, but telling
me that the way Catholics baptized people is wrong also. He referred to
it as "sprinkling water and have a fancy party after." How can in the
name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, be sprinkling
water? Yes, I understand parents in a Catholic church tend to baptize
their children at a very young age. But that gives him no right to call
Catholics unbelievers and not real followers."
Very true. So what to do? Do you approach the pastor about this or keep quiet? I understand reverence and all, but when someone in that kind of position has so much influence, they can poison a lot minds with inaccurate information.
@Soul_Pizza@xanga - I liked your comment. I'll probably get zinged by someone for saying this, but while I believe the Bible is the word of God, some of the teachings were meant for individuals, not to be generalized to the whole world. Funny example - When God commanded Noah to build an Ark, He obviously didn't mean for us all to build a physical Ark. We have to be careful to the take the Bible as a whole. Like you mentioned, when I went through all the references to salvation there are lots of things that we need to do, more than just believe. Perhaps some people needed to hear a particular point, and perhaps we only have pieces of the sermons. Jesus certainly said a lot more things than are recorded in the scriptures. Anyway, it didn't get straightened out for me until I read the Book of Mormon. It and the Bible go together to clear up many misunderstandings. Take care.
This is a rant of mine as well-- or at least in part-- however I disagree in part. You cited a scripture of a man driving out demons; that is a far cry from most things we see today. Remember, Jesus himself said that "not everyone who names the name of the son will be saved".
I did not hear your pastor speak; and I have seen some EXTREMELY horrendous displays of unchristian bitterness towards one another before-- so perhaps your pastor was acting like that; however, Paul himself did call many people false because they did, or taught, things that were not given to them by the Holy Spirit or the Apostles.
So, while there is no end to the frustration that I feel (as a pastor) regarding the divisions in the Church, I also do not compromise the Truth. Having said that, I also realize that there are extremely few things which I consider to be so important that I would not fellowship with someone who names the name of Jesus as the Son of God; but I have come across a few instances where I was forced to separate myself from a person, or group, because their teachings went contrary to what the Gospel teaches, and their actions did not back them up.
Anyway, isn't it hard? Keep praying over this. God teaches us patience towards one another and provides us wisdom to handle situations as they arise. We just can't ever stop striving to be boldly compassionate in the name of Christ.
Good post, but the fact is that there are many Catholics who would not consider you a true Christian.
@Soul_Pizza@xanga - True, Jesus gave different answers when people asked him what they needed to do to get to heaven. But perhaps the reason why he gave different answers wasn't because the thing that they were asked to do was important. Maybe he was getting to the heart issue. Let me explain...
I think Jesus wanted to be the absolute top priority in the lives of those who followed him. For example, I love sports. I watch a lot on TV, I play a few times a week. So if Jesus wanted to be the most important thing in my life, he'd have to remove some of my current top priorities. For the rich young ruler, it wasn't sports, it was money. Jesus asked him to give up something extremely important to him. Another man approached him and said he'd follow after he buried his father. Jesus came back with a harsh sounding response - let the dead bury their own dead. Jesus was challenging him even on the idea that family came before following Jesus. For some, selling all we have is tough. For others, it's easy. For some, a willingness to leave our families behind is tough. For others, it's easy. Some have a love of power and authority. Some refuse to give up a grudge they have. Some love being lazy. Jesus knew each person's 'hangup' to being a follower of Jesus, and called them out on it. It's not that the individual thing was important - it was the importance that each individual had on that specific thing that Jesus wanted to challenge.
It sucks when family doesn't get along.
awesome
You can view this the same with "Christians who don't talk to people of other religions" type deal. Why do some Christians try to convert me when I already stated to them that I'm Buddhist? What makes Christianity so much better than Buddhism? Nothing. What makes Buddhism better than Christianity? Nothing. It's about preference. So, like seculars of Christianity, we should learn to coexist with other religions.
Good point! I think this is an area I'm being shaped in at the moment and a truth that I need to be reminded of. The truth is that Jesus is the only judge. We are not. We do not see hearts, God does. I think we need to personally stick to our own convictions of truth and doctrine, and remember that it's all about having a relationship with Christ. I agree with @Theophilus166@xanga that we should judge theology and doctrine for ourselves and make sure that what we follow lines up with the Bible, but that we are in no place to judge where others stand with Christ if they profess His Name.
There is definitely a place for constructive and respectful discussion, but not hateful accusations or judgement. The Bible says that we are to love as God loves. And I think amazing enough, when Jesus prayed for the believers He prayed for their UNITY.
this is the reason why b/c everyone wants to debate about what their true faith is.. everyone usually judges a certain way about religion.. catholics definitely usually debate a lot.. going onto the forums
and people stating the way they feel about jesus christ. ppl always asked me "oh you are catholic,
does that mean you are christian?" of course, that means i am christian. how can we all debate
about something that we truly don't all know about? that is the question..
@JosephParsons@xanga - well said!
@Soul_Pizza@xanga - Why were you a Christian? I mean what was your reason for believing before?