Thursday, 30 July 2009
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Married By a Gay Minister: Is This Acceptable?
Excuse me while I dump my brain onto this page...
There is a gentlemen who I met through work who was recently ordained to be a minister, that I am considering asking to be the officiant over my wedding. A pretty simple choice...only he is gay. I'm pretty jumbled in the head over whether or not it is "right," on many levels, to have him marry me.
He's homosexual, which according to the book that guides my life, is a sin. BUT, no man or woman is without sin, even pastors and preachers, so if I'm looking for a sinless minister, that isn't going to happen anyway.
I almost feel uncomfortable asking him to marry my fiance and I, when he and his partner are, under law, forbidden to be married. Although I am Christian, I feel that marriage is a right that is part of a group of rights that all United States citizens are entitled to. It is not my place to judge whether or not that marriage is accepted under God, but it is my place as a citizen to advocate for equal rights for all people.
Is it right? Is it wrong? What makes it wrong if it is wrong? That he's homosexual? Ugh, I'm just so confused.
My fiance doesn't see a problem with having him lead our wedding. In all reality, does the officiant of the service, whoever he or she may be, have any bearing on the marriage? Marriage to me is a three way commitment between the man, the woman, and God, so would it even matter if I called a bum in off the street to marry us, if our vows between us and God are sincere?
Boooo to confusion.What do you think? Would it be wrong for me to ask him to be the officiant at my wedding?
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Comments (163)
I doubt he will care. He became a priest realizing he will probably be asked to marry people. Just ask him.
Ask him, and try to keep in mind we have no right in judging other people. He wouldnt have gotten into the feild if he didnt expect to get asked.
Quite frankly, except insofar as legality is concerned, there doesn't need to be anyone in the position of "officiating" at all. You aren't marrying the minister (I don't think you're his type anyway). A vow is a vow, whether it be witnessed or no. If you promise your fiance that you will stay with, love, and be faithful to him for the rest of your natural life, it doesn't matter if there is a heterosexual priest, a homosexual minister, a five year old girl, or a cow in an alfalfa field present. The One Which Is In All (For He Made All) is there, and that is enough. He is the officiator of justice and the bearer of Truth, so let your vow rest there. And let it rest with your husband.
Furthermore, I hold that the alleged biblical condemnation of homosexuality is little more than a severe misinterpretation of several condemnations of rape and pedophilia. Yeshua never spoke on the subject, but in light of the rest of his teaching, I don't believe he would have made a large thing of it. I believe he was far more concerned about whether or not partners were being faithful to each other (which really is their own affair, so to speak) than of what gender those partners were. Speaking as a heterosexual man, I will tell you that all the homosexual and bisexual individuals I know (and I know a fair few) are extremely decent, upright people (for the very best definition of upright man, see the opening chapters of Les Misérables re: Monsiegneur Bienvenu), loving those around them and treating people in general kindly and with respect: In essence, going a long way towards fulfilling that second greatest of all commandments (which is very much like the first, and mirrors it). If a man loves his neighbor as himself, how likely or unlikely is it that he is also behaving in a way that is pleasing to God? I should say very likely indeed. Do not judge or condemn anyone, for any action, for you do not know all and you do not see their hearts. If they are endangering you or others, remove yourself from them or imprison them so that they may do no harm. If it is certain that they have taken life without just cause, it might be acceptable to take theirs. But if they are harming no one by their actions, what cause have you to reproach them?
Furthermore, if this particular minister of which you speak happened to be straight, but had a habit of becoming quite angry at other drivers on the road around him, would you have a problem with him officiating at your wedding? Please do think about that a while.
I wish you and your intended spouse long days and pleasant nights upon the earth, and may you both walk ever blessed beneath the moon and the sun, in the love of the One who wrought both of those lights. May you do well.
He has a partner? Like, a male partner? To be truthful, I wouldn't want him to be the officiant at my wedding. (this is what I believe- but I think people who are gay should try to stay away from that instead of having a partner like he does. It would be too much- especially for my parents, they are very conservative).
"Hate the sin, love the sinner." I believe in equal rights for everyone and homosexuality is normal. There is nothing wrong with a gay minister marrying you and your fiance. If he is a kind hearted gentlemen who believes in peace and love, why should his orientation matter?
It is true that ALL people sin. But is it true that all Ministers know something is a sin yet openly deny it as such and flaunt their sin proudly? The scriptures are very clear on this subject. To deny it is sheer sillyness. The Apostle Paul expounds on it in Romans 1-3. To say that it isn't sin (as one commenter did above me) just because Jesus never mentioned it is not logical. Jesus never talked about child rape either. Does that mean that rape is ok?
For the sake of honoring God first in the marriage I personally would not have him do it. However! Should you choose to. Your marriage is not null-n-void because of the "lack" of any particular minister. In the same way being baptized in a false church does not void the baptism. The agreement is between you... your soon to be...And God Almighty.
May the God of the scriptures richly bless you in your marriage!
~MIchael
I think it is wrong to classify marriage as a "right."
this is as about as intelligent as someone against interracial dating wondering if they should get married by a black guy who has a white wife.
There is a big difference between a person who struggles with the sin of homosexuality (or lying, or adultery, or profanity, insert your sin), and a person who openly practices his sin, then goes into the ministery on top of it, then officiates over people's marriage vows while living in fornication.
I wouldn't want it for me. There's gotta be more than one minister in your town.
@MC_Shann@xanga - Agreed. You said it pretty well.
I think it's perfectly fine to ask him.
i think you can ask him.
Ask him.
p
Of course it's not wrong, however he chooses to live his life (whether you believe it's a "sin" or not) does not concern you in any way. It isn't like this man is going to turn you or your fiance into homosexuals by marrying you, that's just completely irrational.
His personal life is exactly that, his, and it in no way should interfere with your marriage.
"Although I am Christian, I feel that marriage is a right that is part
of a group of rights that all United States citizens are entitled to.
It is not my place to judge whether or not that marriage is accepted
under God, but it is my place as a citizen to advocate for equal rights
for all people."
That's refreshing to hear, coming from a Christian. (I'm not saying all Christians are anti-gay marriage, I'm just saying that the majority that I've come into contact with feel the opposite of you.) Because, marriage is something that involves the government as well as a church, if the certain couple chooses to get married in one. But that's just the thing: you don't have to get a church to approve your marriage unless you want to get married in said church, but you do have to have the government approve it in order to have all of the legal benefits of marriage. And that has nothing to do with religion. Therefore, governments should allow everyone to marry whomever they choose (because it is a right, as you said) despite gender and leave it to the separate churches to write their own rules on who they will marry.
Consider the fact that I am an Atheist... I doubt I will marry anyone who is devout in some religion to the extent of wanting to get married in a church...anyway, I can have my wedding in a vineyard and simply get the government to accept my marriage as lawful, and I would be married, perhaps not "in God's eyes", but legally, I would be.
Personally, seeing as you're accepting of gay marriage, it should not matter to you that your minister is gay. It is a bit like saying that you believe in equal civil rights for African Americans, but then not wanting a black minister to marry you.Because in this century, the big civil rights movement (similar to the one of the last century) will be about gay rights. It's all a cycle, until everyone is truly equally represented under law.
@MC_Shann@xanga - Are you seriously comparing homosexuality to child rape?!
Homosexuality involves two consenting adults, not non consenting children.
Use a better comparison next time, maybe then your point with have some logic.
@avelineaveline@xanga - Im sorry you see it like that. I assure you that making those two sins equal are NOT my intent. The point was shown in order to expose a poor exegesis of scripture that was posted s a comment above.
@Ancient_Scribe@xanga - Agreed.
@interstellarmachine@xanga - I was going to say just about the exact same thing.
If you believe that homosexuality is a sin, and this person is openly engaging in this sin; then it does not seem appropriate. It is one if it is someone who has commited a sin and renounced it, but another it if it is someone who actively lives in what your conscience is sin.
As the old saying goes: "if you have to ask, it's probably wrong." If your conscience is giving you trouble over something like this, then it is usually better to make the choice that you know you won't feel bad for and regret.
@Ancient_Scribe@xanga - I think it is wrong to classify marriage as a "right."
Religiously we know it as a sacrament, but how else is marriage classified?
@MC_Shann@xanga - Okay, I see, I realize my misunderstanding now. Thank you for clarifying.
@LoBornlite@xanga - "The new national policy approved by the Canadian Cabinet on June 17,
2003, views marriage as a way to publicly recognize a committed
relationship between two adults."
I have a question for any of you who don't support same-sex marriage:
Would you vote for gay couples to be able to have civil unions in which they were given the same legal rights that opposite sex couples do in civil marriage?
In other worlds, what if it was just not called marriage for same sex couples, would that make a difference in your views?
Of course it's not wrong. His orientation has nothing to do with your wedding. What you said about never being able to find a sinless pastor is absolutely correct.
@JosephParsons@xanga - @interstellarmachine@xanga - @MC_Shann@xanga - Would you really want a pastor who claimed he didn't sin, or never admitted to sinning? Should he instead be insincere with his congregation? I'm sure he's not mentioning his orientation at every sermon, or anything. I think it makes him more trustworthy. At least he's being honest.
*words. haha.
@avelineaveline@xanga - In other worlds, what if it was just not called marriage for same sex couples, would that make a difference in your views?
I think we already have that. Isn't it called "civil union".
@Jazzyful@xanga - At least he's being honest.
Serial killers are honest too. Charles Manson is very honest about all his butchery. I think those fellows you commented to are concerned with Christian doctrine. Doctrine guides the norms of behavior, not honesty.
Both the wicked and the virtuous can be honest.