Awesome post- I really respect the way you approach this difficult situation that is plaguing American Churches.

I currently interviewing to be a Pastor with long term goals to do missions in China. The same thing has bewildered me for a long time- I have asked why the Churches seem to have passed away from their intended functions. 

I think it is because they have become distracted and enchanted with getting "large numbers".  I respect that goal- as they want to bring the gospel to many- but I also realize that not many will always be willing to listen to the pure gospel of Christ- which is the power of God here on earth.

Perhaps if the Church returned to sound instruction from "the Air", had bible studies, prayer meetings, and community service then we would not feel so lacking in our Churches. 

Here is the problem that I understand (from the pastors side of things).  You get up Sunday, and you preach the true message.  After wards you have some cranky rich old lady who gets mad at your message for one reason or another.  There are demands for you to be "more intellectual". You try to organize a group of your flock to "go out into all the world" and they are to busy watching football on Sunday or partying on the weekend to go with you. 

The point being is that many pastors at many Churches face an obstinate crowd full of people who get mad if you call them to do anything other than sit on the pews.

The good news is that there are still Pastors out there who are willing to take a stand- possibly lose a job- and push for what is right. The bad news is there are fewer and fewer of these pure-hearted pastors each year.

"And My house shall be a House of Prayer" Matthew 21:13... unfortunately Jesus saw the same problem "But you are making it into a Den of Robbers!"

You are a woman with a grenade with the Lord's name on it, and if I weren't married and a man of the Lord, I'd want you to blow up all over me!

Let me tell you, sister, I agree with you, one hundred and ten percent. I tried for years to get my church more militant for the Lord and His Word, but they just sat on their asses, worrying about collection money and being nice and mannerly and not stepping on any chuchgoers' toes lest they don't reach into their pockets. It bothered me some, but then I started to do something about it. I started wearing camouflage, military clothing, to church with a patch, not of the American flag, but of Our Lord's cross. Many stared, but many more noticed me and my all out fight for the Lord. That's when I started my own backyard church, and from my patio, with no need for ordination or nothing, I started preaching the Word of Our Lord, straight from the Bible!

God bless, sister, and keep you strong in your fight!

@ByHisGraceIamSaved@xanga - You are a woman with a grenade with the Lord's name on it, and if I weren't married and a man of the Lord, I'd want you to blow up all over me!

that was the weirdest comment i've ever........nevermind.



My advice is to start something. I'm a pastor, and I wish I had enough time to lead some small groups, but at times I'm already committing 3-4 nights a week to church ministries.   I've had people ask "why isn't there a group for _____?"   I've had people get upset because they mentioned ideas (HUGE events, I might add) to me, and I never did anything with them.  Of course, they never took any initiative, just mentioned it to me in passing and expected me to do something about it.

Sounds like you'd be good at leading a small group yourself. Maybe you should spend some time asking God why he wants you in this church.

If you see areas that are lacking, it's not necessarily wrong of you.  How you handle the frustration is the deciding factor.  Try to be positive and find a solution.  If it deteriorates into blaming, whining, grumbling, etc, that's when you have let it become an unhealthy attitude.

I think a lot of people inside and outside of the church feel the same way you do.  Organized worship for a lot of people is a turnoff, not because it is inherently lame, but because of how it is done.  Although it's easier to just reject it as a whole, I think the real challenge as believers in the body is to take action.  Why lament the situation when we can act?

I'm not sure what course to take.  Prayer, ofc.  Also, ideally you'd have elders who would be open to discussing the state of things.  Furthermore, with some brainstorming and such, hopefully you could come up with things you could implement.  If they don't feel that now is the time to reinstitute small groups officially, find a few other people with similar feelings and start your own.

As far as the tower of Babel goes, the people involved were directly in violation of what God had told them to do, and their motives were not godly.  Most people who desire for the church to be one and to draw closer to God don't share that mindset, so I'm not really sure that the situation applies.  I may be missing something though.

Good post.  I can certainly identify with you.

I am for home Bible study discussion groups, but the Bible says the following:

Philippians 2:1-5
1    If there be therefore any consolation in Christ,

if any comfort of love,

if any fellowship of the Spirit,           

if any bowels and mercies, 
2    fulfill you my joy,
that ye be like-minded,

having the same love,
being of one accord, of one mind.

3   Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory;

but in lowliness of mind,

let each esteem other better than themselves.  
4    Look not every man [or woman] on his [or her] own things,     but every man [or woman] also on the things of others. 
5     Let this mind be in you,

which was also in Christ Jesus.

Ephesians 4:11-16
11    And He [Jesus Christ] gave some,

Apostles; and some, Prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

12    for the perfecting of the saints,
for the work of the ministry,                       
for the edifying of the body of Christ:

13  till we all come in the unity of the faith

and ofthe knowledge of The Son Of God,

unto a perfect man,      

unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ:

14  that we henceforth be no more children,

tossed to and fro,

and carried about with every wind of doctrine, 
by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness,
whereby they lie in wait to deceive;                                   
15     but speaking the truth in love,

may grow up into Him in all things,

Who is The Head, even Christ:

16    from Whom the whole body fitly joined together

and compacted by that which every joint supplieth,
according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body
unto the edifying of itself in love.

Maybe the Lord opened your eyes to this because he wants you to do something, Pray about it and find out what he wants you to do

sunday<>25march<>2009

jonathan s. tait  driveNcry@earthlink.net

mountlake terrace<>washington state<>usa

Greetings fellow bloggers;

several hundred words ago I began my response to the post of March 04, 2009: "Frustrated: My Church Offers Nothing to Christians", but just before it was completed, inadvertant though it was, I completely obliterated it. (Deep sigh.) So very frustrating, but not all is lost, for now I can use that to better segue into my first point.

Having said that, I have never blogged before, and do not even come close to understanding all the ins and outs of it, but am offering my "two cents worth" all the same, to which perhaps some may very well say "Too bad he didn't obliterate this message, too!" If so, in response I will offer my too favorite sayings, "Es perfecto aqui"  (Spanish for "It is perfect here") and "Too Bad-So Sad" (English for "I hope you get over it because I already have.")

...Oh, but if I must be serious, then I humbly invite any and all who might take issue with my observations, in the spirit of the apostle Paul's statement in Romans that "I am confident that you are able to admonish one another". (Great point, Paul; now how exactly did we in the 21st century become so dependent on "hired guns" to do most of the 'dirty work' for us?)

So then, if after reading what I have to offer, anyone concludes that it indeed was not "two cents worth", tell me why you have arrived at that conclusion, and in addition to humbly reviewing my position in light of the Word, when I have the opportunity to meet such persons, for their time invested in my remarks, I will gladly fork over two copper Lincolns. Conversely, to those (how optimistic of me, those being plural) who do indeed find value in my musings, they will owe me one million US dollars...

"Say what?!?!?" you may exclaim... Yes, I place a high value on what I have to offer, so I expect to be compensated. However, the above figure does not actually refer to money, but is a reflection of what I, as a little kid, would often say in response to having anything really cool and totally unexpected occur: "Wow! That made me feel like a Million Bucks!" And so it is today, many years later, that as a Christian, I am convinced that central to the discussion of why churches of today are so far removed from their God given mission, is the individual's reluctance to act on their own in the business of ministering to those in want of attentionand in need of having their anguish acknowledged.

This doesn't mean that you or I or any other Christian with a true servant heart has to meet all of a person's needs; what it does mean is that, if Christ is to be perceived by the world today as dwelling among groups of humans professing to be His children, then someone must be addressing the needs of all who are hurting. (To further illustrate this point, please read the Book of Hebrews, being careful to examine  each use of the word "one". Hint: In it's thirteen chapters, "one" is not used over and over again in reference to doors or windows or days or other inanimate objects, but something much more dear to the heart of God.) The world of difference between being obligated to meet a person's needs as compared to having a heart to address them seems so painfully obvious to me, but if called upon to do so, I am committed to explain it more clearly. 

And what if the previous statement rings true with your intellect, but  the thought of actually taking the initiative to serve someone independent of any church activity strikes fear in your heart (a weakness  certainly not sanctioned by God; see I Timothy 1:7)?  But, if your timidity is somehow linked to    unlimited resources, then by all means, why be vulnerable in serving others in hopes of compelling them to exclaim "Wow! That (your love) made me feel like a Million Bucks!" when you could just redeem your obligation for accepting "my two cents worth" by sending me one million dollars in cold, hard cash?

In hopes of having said at my funeral that I was truly a team player, I would certainly try to accommodate the fearful and accept their dollars, but since I have no need at this time for that much money, I would much rather, selfishly speaking, that your appreciation of "my (soon to follow) two cents worth" be paid back throughout your lifetime by serving the multitudes who are not expecting anything good to happen, but, so very appreciative of being  blessed by your concern would thus exclaim "Wow! That (your expression of love) made me feel like a Million Bucks!"

I guess one could say that is the consummate "Interest Only" loan: Although it can never be paid off, what better way to spend one's life than to be indebted with a "Spiritual Mortgage", that is, being compelled to have "Interest<>Only" in those Who God is especially interested in, that is, all those who are "distressed and downcast, like sheep not having a shepherd" (Matthew 9:28-30). (Look to your left, look to your right; they are all around you, inside the body of Christ, and wandering outside of it as well.)

Now that I have established the cost and possible repayment schedules of my words, I would like to posit the following question: "Is there a 2009 equivalent, or equivalents, to the golden calf of Moses' day, that is lending itself to compel churches to miss their God given mission?" If so, what is it, or what are they? Through many years of being a Christian and the requisite time spent pondering just what is going on, what we (as a local body) are doing, what is working, what is not working, etc., I have concluded that yes indeed, we have at least one G-C-E ("Golden Calf Equivalent"), alive and well, not just all of a sudden now in 2009, but for many generations hindering the will of God, all under the guise of something that is almost universally accepted as necessary to accomplish His desire. Continue reading to discover what I am convinced this is.

I think it fair to summarize that Moses, acting in faith, on behalf of the multitude that God chose him to lead, was serving them, when he went up the mountain for their benefit to receive the Ten Commandments. Conversely, instead of patiently waiting in faith, they basically said "Where is God that we may worship him?" (Compare this with Romans 12:2, i.e., for the Christian, worship cannot be confined to some things to be done in a distinct place nor a distinct time.) "We need something that we can see and touch. We need physical proof that our worship has merit!"

And so it is today, rather than "living by faith", so many focus their energies on... lets just call it M-T-A, that is "Maximum Theory Acquisition". Not that anybody in particular wants it to be this way, it is just one of the challenges that we all have inherited for being born into the way things are at this present place in history.

I have a friend named John, who when we were once discussing a much more mundane earthly subject, of which a great percentage of the United States population feels very passionately about, shared how someone that he knows once encouraged him to "Follow the Money!" In other words, when a person, persons, or entity gets very excited about the furtherance of the matters important to them, then "Follow the Money!" to determine who is personally benefitting most from the necessary sacrifices that others are making to enable whatever the cause is. Doing a little investigating will often enable one who searches to recognize the potential motives of those so benefitting, resulting in the ability to view the situation with the clearest possible  perspective.

Which brings us to the 21st century body of Christ, or more accurately, as He is represented by many local congregations whose mission, in so many words, is "being the earthly representation of Christ to the community in which we dwell."  And just what exactly  does my (your, their, etc.) congregation have to do with Moses and the Ten Commandments? Is there some sort of connection that I have been missing all of my years as a Christian? Well, my answer to that is yes; there certainly is a 2009 Golden Calf Equivalent residing among Christians today, and although so very pervasive, seemingly invisible to the average individual professing to be a follower of Jesus.

Unfortunately, even though with great confidence what I am referring to is so often utilized by local congregations to further safeguard the goal (in heaven) of receiving "a trophy", the far too often result here on earth is the "atrophy" of individual Christians. The primary factor dividing the two extremely different situations being determined by what each individual does "with their space"; yes, a play on words, re: the "space" between the 'a' and the 't', but sadly, all too true nonetheless. ("What will I do with my 'space'?")

And what then will I do, with my "two cents worth"? Do I just content myself to find fault, and thus limit my input to being "part of the problem", or are my two copper Lincolns comprehensive enough to offer solutions? Before answering that question, let me first present a couple of passages from The Book of Proverbs: "Better is open rebuke/Than love that is concealed<> Faithful are the woundings of one who loves you/ But deceitful are the kisses of an enemy. 27:5,6;  (literal translation in italics) and 27:17, "Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another."

I am compelled to include those verses for the benefit of  those who might ask "What right does he (or she, or they, etc.) have to criticize the church?" Of course, it is always best to produce possible solutions whenever identifying problems, but as far as finding fault goes, I have seldom improved spiritually, physically, occupationally, relationally, or any of my other -allies, as far as I know, as a result of being heaped with praise. Healthy entities, growing entities, whatever the arena, are best challenged to grow when blessed with honest evaluations.

Alrighty then, on to the solution, and then to declare what I think to be our 2009 G-C-E ("Golden Calf Equivalent"). My solution, anyway, which I think will work for anyone who wants to "prove what is pleasing to the Lord" (Ephesians 5:10); hopefully by learning to integrate it into the readers' lives, it will help not only them, but those who hear them (I Timothy 4:16) to "receive a trophy" in heaven, and certainly to avoid "atrophy" while here on the earth...

My solution for  anyone frustrated by the lack of meaningful offerings for Christians from any local church is to become...More of a servant. What I will say on the matter regarding the obligation of the local body and the opportunites of the individual brother or sister in Christ is offered up with no malice on my part, for certainly I did not do anything to warrant myself worthy of arriving at this truth, except that when trudging through a very prolonged period of time that was very much L-T-X (you will just have to get to the end to find out what that acronym represents) for me, I kept on going. Though having little faith in my own worthiness, I had enough faith (or perhaps "just enough faith") in God to "put the left in front of the right" for a billion steps, or two billion, or two and a half billion; however many it was.

And so it was, by chance, because of my selfish needs to be regarded as having value, and ultimately, by the grace of God, I discovered that the most powerful means of having my needs met,  although even having them addressed by either of the congregations I attended spanning that difficult period, was pretty much just not going to happen (Yeah, what about Jesus having compassion on the multitudes, Matthew 9:28-30?), because the majority of "Chrisitians"  have for the most part pretty much adopted the position that "God does not really expect me to minister (touch the lepers) to anyone who is not X-L-M!"...(But they will certainly put hours and hours and springs and summers and autumns and winters and years,  years and more years into learning how to be "the earthly representation of Christ to the community in which we dwell".)

Yes, though it seems that the design of God would  be that those who are hurting, to become whole, first would have their needs addressed by those who, ostensibly, would care for them the most (their local "church") in order to determine how such needs can be met, clearly it is obvious to most of the readers that it often does not occur like this. As for me, by the default of fallible man and the grace of our perfect God, I somehow figured out, after the fact, that by serving others, most if not all of my needs can be quite successfully mitigated. That is, maybe, to a great extent, as a Christian, my needs do not "have to" be met. And How can this be? For when one perceives their life to be hopelessly L-T-X, it is all too easy to forget that, what the brother or sister in Christ really needs more than anything else, is to live like "it is enough for the disciple to become as his teacher, and the slave to become as his master" (Matthew 10:25a)... And why is this so?

What does anyone in this life really want, Christian or not? I will contend that it is to be valued, to be important, to "feel like a Million Bucks!" And so it was that because my needs were ignored (obvious as they were to non-believers, and so should have been to those claiming to be seeking the intuitive love and heart of Jesus), they were met, in spite of circumventing the usual path requiring that they be, at the very least, acknowledged, and hopefully, addressed, that is, by my becoming more and more of a servant to others, selfish though my original motives were. (I didn't put it in these words then, but I simply wanted to "feel like a Million Bucks!")

Allow me to include here in my two cents worth a true story that occurred to me over the course of the last twelve months or so, and indeed, is continuing to occur. I met someone a few years ago who I will just refer to as 'Sibling A'. Upon our first meeting, my heart went out to this person, for it was obvious that there was a lot of hurt taking place... By chance (God's grace, by His design?) many months later, I met this person again, this time having 'Sibling B' present. As the situation warranted it, because that very day had been a very difficult and significant one for 'Sibling A',  I was able to offer words of advice, comfort, and even a very colorful gift (something that I purchase many of every year in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, for this very purpose) to serve as a constant reminder that, even though not feeling that way, that "the world is a more beautiful place because of your presence in it."

Many weeks later, I again saw 'Sibling B' at the same place, and was honored in no small measure by 'B's' recalling one of the things I had shared previously when we first met... And as you can guess, the fact that my 'serving' of 'Sibling A' was remembered with such exuberance by 'Sibling B' is a continuing force in helping me to "meet my (most important) needs", that is, to be more like Jesus... Because in honoring me for my willingness to be vulnerable in serving 'Sibling A', that day 'Sibling B' made me "...feel like a Million Bucks!" Or as Dick Vitale, the television commentator of college basketball games, would exude in his trademark phrase, "It's awesome, Baby!"

Indeed it is; many years ago, when first entering, by no choice of my own, into a very difficult period of time, I was seated next to the parents of one of the kids on my older son's Junior High wrestling team at one of their matches. Shannon shared with me how some years previous, when he was facing a similar experience (though for him the outcome, relationally, was positive; a reconciliation), that it too was very, very hard for him to bear. When I asked him how he dealt with it, he replied "I stayed very busy in my father's wrecking yard, tearing cars apart."  To which I remember saying, oh so longingly, and as clearly as if it happened today, "I wish I had a wrecking yard to work in." 

Fast forward a few years, and praise be to God, I get to work in His wrecking yard of wounded souls, and that as much as I want to and more. No one can prevent me from continuing to add to the portfolio of appreciative people that I have been so blessed to serve, and in response to the continual amassing of my very own spiritual highlight reel, I am so blessed to hear, not just  Dick  Vitale, but Jesus himself exclaim, "It's awesome, Baby!"...

But let me not forget to finish the story of 'Sibling A' and 'Sibling B', because it gets much better. 'Sibling C', who I see very frequently, out of appreciation for my willingness to bless 'Sibling A', has apparently decided that, in appreciation for my willingness to make 'Sibling A' "...feel like a Million Bucks", is on a mission to make me "...feel like a BILLION Bucks", and by my estimation, 'Sibling C' has so far got me feeling somewhere between one hundred and two hundred million! And in regards to my 'needs', what needs? The only 'need' that I am cognizant of in this, my  L-T-X existence, is for an occasional break to take it all in, this incredible, immeasurable value of being a servant.

A few more thoughts before I close. If one is frustrated by the lack of meaningful substance within the local congregation one is a member of, what is to prevent them from, as other writers on this blog have suggested, to step up and make things happen? If things go well, then give thanks to God for allowing you to serve Him... And if for any reason things do not go well, not limited to but including resistance within your congregation, then it is time to reevaluate and to give thanks to God for allowing you to seek Him. If this then finds  you seeking somewhere else (congregationally), just be vigilant to guard against previous disappointments making any new groups you might visit to subjectively seem wonderful, when in fact, a patient and objective examination, in light of the Word, is called for, and give praise for that opportunity as well.

In response to feeling that there are in fact many needs going (UNADDRESSED and) unmet, in the course of talking with others who feel the same, I have rekindled the idea of initiating a group which we would refer to as "The Breakfast Club", i.e., borrowing from the 1980's era movie about the unwanted kids in Saturday detention at their High School. Personally, I do not need it, but I know many who could be served by it; not only those within our congregation with specific hurts, but in order to meet another most important need, (by 'doing') to inspire any or the many, as the case may be, who feel deluded by too many years of being, to some extent, mindlessly engaged in M-T-A, "Maximum Theory Acquisition." 

Finally, in response to my earlier question as to whether there is in fact a 2009 "Golden Calf Equivalent" (or equivilents, plural) plaguing the current state of Christianity, I am persuaded that we have at least one. It is my conviction that our 2009 G-C-E,  far too often, is our dependence on physical property (church buildings and their requisite attendant costs and staff) to "do the will of God", as proof that we are in fact measuring up to his expectations, and as evidence that we are making a difference in the community. Unfortunately, it is so much easier to look at what we have accomplished physically, with our physical presence, and to justify all the energy focused on them, not becuase we have a recent track record of utilizing them in a most effective work for God, but because it is there that we will continue to "Maximize Theory Acquisition", often not realizing that the accumalation of knowledge, of itself, does not prove us "to be  the earthly representation of Christ to the community in which we dwell."

Permit me to paraphrase from a story that was written and/or shared with me by a Preacher named Eldon Lewis many years ago..."How much information do we need on how to be orange pickers, before we will put a worthy amount of our energy into actually picking oranges?"  It seems to me that in far too many cases, rather than focusing on the "sign" (our message) that calls out to the lost to be free in Jesus, many brothers and sisters in Christ have somehow come to see the billboard (church buildings) that hold up the message as being absolutely imperative and inseperable from the message itself and inherently necessary and the primary means of conveying the good news of freedom from sin through Jesus. An objective consideration of the evidence does not lead me to believe this can possibly be true.

Did God need to create His body of believers, and then to observe them for a few centuries or so to learn from them and thus determine how He could best accomplish His will on earth? I do not think so; but conversely, does man, as revealed in the scriptures, have a habit of attempting to improve on what God has asked of him? In the New Testament record, one can easily see lots of evidence of congregations that were growing and "on fire"; however, how many examples in the Word will we find of local bodies of Christ owning real estate for the purpose of furthering the will of God in the communities in which they seek to be the "representation of Christ on earth"?

Remember my remarks about my conversation with my friend, John, and his admonition to "Follow the Money!"? Again, I ask the reader to consider, who is benefitting most from the requirement of large congregations housed in big structures owned by the congregations that use them? I am not saying that in every case it is wrong for a church to own the property they meet in; however, I will say that it seems that seeking to replicate the biblical model will in almost every single case be more beneficial to the congregation and to the community they seek to reach out to. Paul emphatically defended his right to be paid as an evangelist, but also made a living as a tentmaker, beholden to noone but the truth of God. 

I dont know about Christianity, but it is very easy to see that "Church"anity is big business. If  you want something to touch to prove that your faith is real, why seek a golden calf when you could find much more meaning by touching people's hearts? Be vulnerable, be bold. Be accountable, be careful. Be willing to embrace, emotionally, not just those who are X-L-M, but those who are loved by God. (Which would be, to be exact, everyone.)

My favorite passage is Hosea 6:1-3. In closing, I want to encourage all to consider it's sentiments, take it's principles to heart, and always be willing to remind any who are discouraged that "each day: a BRAND NEW one".  "Be well by choosing well", and for all who made it this far, thank you for considering my thoughts. I hope that for all the "two copper Lincolns" I owe my readers, that at least one of you, like a whale sifts through millions of gallons of water in a day to provide enough food to sustain it, will have found enough value in my many words to result in at least one person someday exclaiming "Wow! That made me feel like a Million Bucks!"

Regardless of the impact that my words in this blog (I hope I am doing everything correctly!) may have on anyone, let's all keep working on our spiritual highlight reels, for in the eyes of God "It's awesome, Baby!"

Sincerely yours,

jonathan s. tait

L-T-X: "Less Than eXcellent" 

X-L-M: "eXactly Like Me"

PS: Please pray for Dick Vitale and whoever else we deem as inspiring, so that their exuberance may have an eternal purpose. "I miss you already."