Wednesday, 03 December 2008
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QOTD: Premarital Sex is Wrong But What About Masturbation?
Guest post submitted by a iM_a_GeM
Is it wrong for us to pleasure ourselves? I know that it says in the Bible that permarital sex is wrong and that you should wait until marriage, and it's a sacred gift to give, but what if you don't get married? I mean we're pleasuring our own selves and not having sex or doing all those other things so why can't we have fun with our bodies?
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Comments (187)
masturbation itself physically is not wrong, but because you need to fantasize to be having sex with the opposite sex, then it's those thoughts that makes it wrong.
Well, Scripture never mentions masturbation in any way shape or form. If it were itself inherently sinful, you'd think the Levitical laws (which prohibit everything from wearing wool-and-linen blend cloth to shaving the corners of your beard) would have mentioned it. We're told that if a man gets an "emission" on himself that he must wash and is unclean until nightfall, but that's it.
(The closest you get is the story of Onan, but using that story as a prohibition for masturbation is stretching: it tells you right in the story that God killed him, not for spilling his seed, but because he refused to raise up an heir for his brother.)
What is sinful is looking at a woman to lust after her--as Jesus told us when he updated the Jewish laws from actions to thoughts. Looking at a woman to lust after her is equivalent to committing adultury with her, because even if you didn't do the action your heart isn't in the right place. Which of course is where it gets tricky. Is it possible to masturbate without lusting? *ponder*
Another factor: for males, anyway, "emission" is something that occurs naturally whether we masturbate or not. So the "seed-spilling" aspect isn't the sinful part, if there's a sinful part.
I don't think I can make a blanket statement here like "Masturbation is always wrong" or "Masturbation is always just fine." But I think I will go out on a limb to say that masturbation doesn't have to be wrong. I think that, within reasonable limits and if the person isn't actively lusting (such as using porn as an aid), it can be all right. Pornography is far more intrinsically harmful--and sinful--than mere masturbation.
Scripture does say not to be mastered by anything... and masturbation can be an addictive thing....
but lemme also just say masturbation is more about lust than anything else.... part of the reason porn is published so that men can pleasure themselves in a false-sense of fantasy and in turn really just be addicted to it...
i mean, if you masturbate cuz you're thinkin about John Deere lawnmowers, seek help or u know...
so masturbation in that light is wrong because lust is the issue behind it....
BUT... in Doug Rosineau's book... spousal mutual masturbation is A-OK... marital freedom is championed in that book... because it's about serving each other IN the bedroom and if one wants it... then... the spouse should do something about it...
Difficult question. I feel like it's wrong. (i.e. It's probably wrong for me), but I can't point to a definite rule for others. I do think it's almost always (if not always) very tied to lust, even if it's not tied to something or someone specific.
It's just wrong. I would rather catch my kid having premarital sex than see them touching themself. Maybe God feels the same way? I donno.
marital union should always be open to life...masturbation is not
a great book for everyone to read is "every woman's battle" and "every man's battle" which both talk about masturbation. the authors say that sex is a gift for married couples, and when one (married or single) masturbates, it's like telling/showing God that one doesn't need His gift, i.e. like saying, "i can pleasure myself, so thanks, but no thanks to the gift you've given to me in my spouse or will give to me in my future spouse." it could also be like saying, 'God doesn't know what's best for me, so i'm going to take care of things on my own.'
@merendina@xanga - Really? I'd think that, with all the possible consequences of the former (pregnancy, STDs), that the latter would be preferable, even if the latter is also wrong...
Masturbation is a selfish act...and let's be honest, pretty much nobody in the Christian Community thinks masturbation is a GOOD thing that is ALWAYS okay. Therefore to err on the side of cautious and common sense is to say we shouldn't do it.
The only times I can see masturbation being a good (or at least not necessarily a bad) thing is when
1.) you're doing it with a blank mind (which is very, very difficult) for the reason of breaking an addiction to porn (this actually helps a lot)
2.) you're married but you and your spouse are currently not near each other (e.g. business trip) and you do it while thinking about your spouse in order to avoid being consumed by lust.
But as others have said...lust is wrong, masturbation is a byproduct of lust, so in general (i.e. almost always), it is something to be avoided.
as for "having fun with your body," there are many, much more entertaining things you can do than jacking off (e.g. play guitar, play computer games, go for a jog, read a book, hang out with friends, etc.). And it's a very slippery slope, "Sex can wait; masturbate" is a very difficult and misleading montage to live by, one thing almost always leads to another....
I don't think it's that wrong. But how you get turned on enough to do it is wrong.
From a Christian perspective:
Sex is designed to be a selfless act. In a godly marriage, one should be focused on their spouse, not using them to find pleasure. In this way, if both the husband and wife are giving to the other, they both are fulfilled. Masturbation is entirely self-focused, and I would suggest when one does this they are robbing their spouse of a pleasure only they should be allowed to give them. Sex is not meant to be a shameful act, but when it is abused, all sorts of shame and guilt are heaped on us.
@sheepthatsblack@xanga - i disagree that this act should ever be brought into marriage. sex is meant to be an act of giving, not merely receiving. if we cannot control ourselves while our spouse is away i would question our commitment to them while they are present.
@merendina@xanga - i don't think either is preferable. masturbation is addicting and shameful, but by sleeping with someone else before marriage is binding...and the repercussions can be far reaching.
@merendina@xanga - Really? I would DEFINITELY rather catch my kid masturbating than having pre-marital sex. Masturbation is not as harmful as pre-marital sex. With sex comes emotional ties (ESPECIALLY if the kid is female). When the two stop seeing eachother (which will usually be inevitable if they are teenagers), the kid will be very distraught. Also, there's the whole worry with STDs, pregnancy and all that. With masturbation though, they're only harming themselves (if that's what you think masturbation is doing).
I don't think masturbation is wrong in and of itself. I agree that if it's accompanied by lust, which often it is, then it is sinful.
I never really thought about it being a selfish act until I read these comments. And, I definitely see how it is, but I still don't really know that it's wrong in and of itself, as I stated.
Also though, it can become very addicting. So, if you are participating in such acts, don't let it replace God or anything. That goes for all things though.
@quiet_strength - I love your point about sex being a giving, rather than receiving, thing...but I think you misunderstand me. I'm not saying masturbation should be a common routine when you two are apart, but a sort of last resort. I'm also not saying it's a "good" thing per se, but a lesser of two evils (masturbation vs. burning with lust). Going off that, if someone can't control him/herself whenever s/he is away from his/her spouse, I would agree, that's a problem (I wouldn't go so far as to question level of commitment, but it's most certainly a problem), but everyone has "those days," y'know? Unfortunately we can't turn the libido on and off at will. It goes on its own accord and we are supposed to regulate it, if you will. Idealy, we wouldn't burn with lust ever, but the fact is that sometimes it happens (unless you are a much stronger person and better Christian than I and everyone I know...this isn't a sarcastic/patronizing statement at all...if you are, then please, as my sibling in Christ, help me fight the Tempter)....When it happens, isn't masturbation while thinking about your spouse less bad (both in terms of emotional harm it produces and sinfulness) than mentally committing aldutery in your heart?
@merendina@xanga -
"I would rather catch my kid having premarital sex than see them touching themself."
I'm curious. Why?
"mean, if you masturbate cuz you're thinkin about John Deere lawnmowers, seek help or u know..." Rofl...was 2 funny, :)
I just stopped to read the comments because I think this is ONE issue that has never fully been decided..whether masturbation is right or wrong, but I have a rule of thumb I incorporate along these lines. If it feels wrong to you, then more than likely it is. It's like stealing, the feeling you have about that, or the feeling you have when you do something nice for a little old lady. One is a feeling of it's wrong, one is a lovely feeling. I think we ONLY have to look that far to know whether it is right or wrong, but that is just my opinion, :)
@sheepthatsblack@xanga - no, i think i understood you correctly, perhaps i just have stronger opinions on this matter. i do not want to be demeaning to you in any way, so please do not take offense at my convictions :)...i think that sexual temptation is among the greatest in the world, and i am not trying to minimize the temptation whatsoever...I know it is HUGE...i have been there. but i do not agree that this is something that "has" to be regulated...it may seem like it at the time, but from experience i would encourage one to cut the temptation off at first hints of even the thought of it...call a friend, run around the room, anything...the longer we entertain it the stronger the temptation becomes before it is out of control. i believe there are many people in the world who are called to singleness and can also stay pure in this way...we are created with huge desires, but we are also given the ability to master those desires and not let them consume us.
I don't see anything wrong with it, even after reading all these answers.
Oh well, maybe I'm just some heathen.
@quiet_strength - AMEN...the Bible says "resist the devil and he will flee from you." But the key is stopping the temptation immediately. It may mean going for a drive or making dinner, but this scripture has been tried and tested and proven, at least by me. :) And just FYI, gospel music will run the little sucker off faster than anything, ESPECIALLY if YOU sing to it like I do. I think he has soft ears not tolerable to my singing, :)
From the Catechism:
2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action." "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."
To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.
@quiet_strength - but on that note, the Bible says the bed is undefiled, at least for the married. From what preachers have told me, ANYTHING there is allowed and fitting, but just what I've been told, :)
@MysteriumFidei@xanga - No harm intended, but I've a simple mind...can you put that in regular words, lol, :)
@JUSTAVAPORHERE@xanga - i have heard that also, but i disagree with it. there are certain things that i would find degrading, even with my husband whom i know would never intend to degrade me. i have heard it put that mankind is the only species whom face each other during sexual union, and it was intended to be that way, we should be focused on each other, not ourselves. masturbation is, in my opinion, very selfish.
@JUSTAVAPORHERE@xanga - Hey there, no problem. The gist of the statement is that masturbation is immoral because it separates the physical pleasure of sex from the means which God gave for us to have it. Sexual pleasure is to be had by a man and his wife, and therefore all sexual encounters outside of that context are immoral.
One of the primary purposes of sex is procreation; since masturbation has no procreative possibility, it is considered to be "intrinsically and gravely disordered" according to the Church.