Sunday, 19 October 2008

  • My Salvation Questioned Because I Voted Democrat

    magnolia by miss magnolia 

    My Salvation Was Questioned Because of My Presidential Candidate Choice

    Back when John Kerry was running against George W for the presidency, I had my mind set on voting for John Kerry. I remember getting together at my youth pastor's house with a bunch of the girls from my youth group. We were in a heated discussion about the elections and I remember that I was the only one voting Democrat. Suddenly the attention was on me and it became this back and forth fire between the pastor and his wife versus me.

    It wasn't so much of a fire back and forth but more of a yelling at me for not voting for George W because he was a born again Christian. I was explaining why I felt that Kerry was the better candidate and all I kept getting back from them was, "Are you a Christian? Do you believe in abortion?" and of course, I answered in the affirmative in regards to my salvation. The whole abortion thing was a whole different story. I don't think abortion is right, but I would not condemn a woman for getting an abortion because I don't know the shoes she walks in or her state of mind when she goes in for an abortion. Only we know why we sin the way we do and because I couldn't give them an affirmative response to the abortion question, everyone immediately thought I wasn't saved or something of the sort.

    So this argument goes back and forth and everyone is asking me why I wanted to vote for Kerry. I explained my perspectives based on his stance on different issues in comparison to George W's positions on things. (have to vote for the one who I had the most in common with, not who I completely agreed with.)

    Anyway, to make a long story short, I felt like that incident was really unnecessary and wrong. I was maybe only 19 at the time and in the first years of college. I loved my church, but at that moment I felt like an outsider because of who I had decided to vote for. It was so unfair and I felt like they were treating me like a leper for not voting for George W.  It was wrong on so many levels and I couldn't understand why we couldn't just agree to disagree. I'd never challenge anyone's salvation based on who they were voting for. Why would we, as Christians, cast each other out like that? Although they never apologized, I forgave them for doing that. It made me realize that when we get too caught up in things of this world, even important things like presidential elections, they can come in between fellow believers and we need to remember that we are not of this world.

    No matter who wins this year's election, I'm praying that God will still work through him to change this country.

    Do you talk about politics with friends or people at church?

     

     

Comments (164)

  • thegreatchristopher@xanga

    its part of why i no longer go to church and became a panthiest....

  • trunthepaige@xanga

    Yes I do all the time.

    Oh and sorry to say this, but It seems you are going to hell with all the other democrats.

    That was a joke you know

  • Allen_Oz@xanga

    It's because abortion seems to be the be-all-end-all of all political decisions. Because of that republicans (who we always assume to be pro-life) are never in the wrong.

  • saintvi@xanga

    That's why I never tell anyone who I'm voting for, even if it's for the "church approved" candidate. I also refuse to sign petitions in church and I leave the sanctuary if the announcements or sermon turn to political matters. I have an abhorrence of church and politics mixing because it does make those who have differing opinions feel disenfranchised and unwelcome when they wish to worship. Since we left our old church and began attending a different one, those moments of discomfort on Sunday morning are gone and I haven't once had to refuse to sign a petition in the church foyer.

  • musterion99@xanga

     I don't think abortion is right, but I would not condemn a woman for
    getting an abortion because I don't know the shoes she walks in or her
    state of mind when she goes in for an abortion.

    Since you're a Christian, I take it that you believe that when a woman is pregnant, she has a baby inside of her. So if we re-word your statement to say -  " I don't think abortion is right, but I would not condemn a woman for murdering her baby because I don't know the shoes she walks in or her
    state of mind when she goes in for an abortion." - Would you still feel the same way?

  • laytexduckie@xanga

    I talk about it with friends and family. Despite the fact that about 80% of my family is Republican, I still vote Democrat because I believe in Obama's policies. In fact, my cousin in Boston (who is a hardcore Republican) is actually not voting this year because she always voted Republican and she's isn't comfortable with McCain. But, it is wrong of your pastor and his wife to tell you you're not a Christian simply because you voted Democrat. We, as people, need to leave religion out of politics. Regardless of the fact that Christianity is the largest religion in the world, the United States of America is a free country: freedom of speech, press and freedom to worship whomever you wish. To full press Christianity on a diverse and free nation makes it . . . well, not free at all. 

  • CFOT_A_Journey@xanga

    This is exactly why I have get so disgusted every four years. I am a Christian first. I believe we all should be regardless of our political leanings. We are brothers and sisters in Christ, yet no where in the Bible does it say which party we must belong to; only how we are to behave as Christians. Sadly, that pastor and his wife were not behaving as they should.


    God already knows the outcome of the election. It is already a part of His overall plan. Does that mean we are not to participate in the election? Absolutely not! All it means is we are all instruments in His plan.


    Pray for this country ... then GO vote. Vote for the best candidate for the office, at all levels, not just the party.

  • too_pretty_to_die@xanga

    my advice: find a new church.  a pastor has absolutely no business telling you how to vote.  no one does, really. 

    but i feel your pain... my dad is a Republican, and he makes sure i know i'm going to Hell for being an Obama fangirl ;) 

  • lastingoptions@xanga

    @musterion99@xanga - really...are we going to get into an abortion debate? How about we stick to the topic at hand.

    Sheesh.

  • CiaoBella810@xanga

    Gods will, will be done no matter what.  Pray and vote.  That's all that is important.  Ask the Lord who you should vote for and if you feel in your heart that is the right decision then go with it.  To be quite honest, associating yourself with a party doesn't mean that you are a follower of Christ. To vote based off of one issue, seems a little silly that's like buying a car only because it has nice wheels, what about whats under the hood...People are going to have to work out there own salvation with fear and trembling...so leave it at that. I don't agree with abortion, wont do it.  If someone dose do it, i will pray for them. That's all i can do. That's all anyone can do. 

  • megank1991@xanga

    I think the fact that a lot of Churches are telling people things like this is why Christianity is being ruined in America. I consider myself a devout Catholic, but I despise the fact that many Bishops have taken the normal teaching of the Church to an extreme and said if you vote for a candidate who is ok with abortion but do so for other reasons you are still sinning. The Church teaching has always been you cannot vote for a candidate BECAUSE of the candidate being for abortion, but they have misrepresented that teaching. 

  • hubbaduh@xanga

    What did your youth pastor say about all of this???

    I voted for W, not simply b/c he's a born-again Christian, but b/c there was no way in hades I was going to vote for someone who was pro-murder like Kerry (pro-choice = pro-murder in my book).

  • sirnickdon

    @musterion99@xanga - If a vegetarian pointed out to you that you had murdered your lunch, would it change your mind or your lifestyle?  No, for a very good reason.  You think they're wrong.  They believe animals have equal rights with people.  You don't.  They have arguments for their beliefs; their arguments don't persuade you.

    (Unless you're a vegetarian; then substitute filling your gas tank/funding Middle-eastern terrorists.)

    Many very decent, very intelligent, very genuine American Christians aren't convinced by arguments that a fetus is a person.  I am not one of them, and I see abortion as a tragedy to be actively fought against by the church, but I don't think that guilt tactics and rhetoric are effective tools.

    ---

    But to the topic at hand, I think that the main problem is a sense of primacy among Christians who expect that the church ought to have a say over the culture, ought to exert some level of control over nonbelievers.  Christendom has replaced discipleship.  Really, the church ought to be a community defined by the practices instituted by Christ - renunciation of violence, extension of hospitality, truth-telling, reconciliation, forgiveness - and stand as a political alternative to the ways of the nation-states. 

    -ND

  • tupacodaman88@xanga

    That's really ignorant of your pastor and church community to question your beliefs. I'm atheist, but I agree with the notion that we should love our neighbors and that we are all different. People of the same religion are obviously very diverse, especially Christians. Ethiopian Christians in the United States may have felt Kerry was a better representation of their values (random example, I know nothing about how their church contrasts with other christian groups (Roman Catholics, etc)). You're totally right though: what many people are too ignorant to understand is that everyone is their own person that should be able to do what they want. If I want to, I can do heroin but I would face obvious repercussions. If I feel like the benefits from doing heroin are greater than the negative consequences, then it shouldn't matter to anyone else what I do (I don't do drugs :), just sayin as an example). Likewise, abortion is a choice given to a woman that should not be taken away. One woman may feel it is equal to murder, the other may not. You can't force your moral codes on other people

  • dorisito@xanga

    Thank you,

    I never understand why people need to push their believes on to others.

  • AGraceB@xanga

    Gosh, I understand. I consider myself both a Christian and a Democrat, and it can sometimes be a huge issue. I personally think it's very possible, and that my political and religious views are complementary, but a lot of people don't. I get a lot of flack about it. I wore a "Christians for Kerry" button a lot during the last election year. 

  • musterion99@xanga

    @sirnickdon - It's a false analogy. The point of my comment is that I'm speaking to a Christian who acknowledges that abortion is wrong.

  • musterion99@xanga

    @lastingoptions@xanga - Abortion was a relevant part of the topic. Did you read the post?

  • yertmax6680@xanga

    As long as you selected your candidate by careful, prayerful consideration (the way we should make every decision--even what we wear in the morning or what we want on our burritos at Chipotle!) and not on your thoughts or feelings, then your decisions were/are/have been justified.


    God often causes His followers to do different things that others, even Christian others, won't understand.  It happened between Paul and Barnabas about Mark.  In the end, though (it took a while), they were again united in the Spirit.  They disagreed vehemently, but both were led by God.


    It just goes to show how little our ways are like His.

  • DirtyAndShaken@xanga

    I do, but for one, I won't talk to someone I know will take MY opinion personally or a personal attack on them, and two, I won't talk to someone I know who will try to beat their choice into me.  In general when it comes to anyone work-related, general strangers or clergy, voting should be a personal choice.  You should vote for whom you believe to be the better candidate and who you feel convicted to vote for.  Don't become part of someone else's campaign to do what THEY think is right.

  • wings_01@xanga

    I think that sometimes those we go to church with treat it like it's a society that only works if we all think the exact same way.  In the last election, I voted for the man I felt most comfortable with, and that was John Kerry.  I got so much crap about it for months after the fact, but it made me think about something: if they're spending so much time worrying about my voting choices, who is praying for the man who was elected to lead? 

    I think that even though our friends mean well, too much time is spent on things that don't matter, and it makes us forget what's really important.

  • DirtyAndShaken@xanga

    On the opposite end of the spectrum, I can relate to people raising their eye at you.  I am Conservative, but I am not part of the religious right.  I am pro-life for myself, but in general, I am pro-choice.  I don't feel it's my place to make those choices for someone else nor judge them for it.  That is like breaking a cardinal rule as a Conservative, so I feel like my identity is questioned all the time, too.

  • lastingoptions@xanga

    @musterion99@xanga - It was a relevant topic but you missed the point.

  • alexiah100@xanga

    I have learned as I have voted democrat in the past on many occasions that my politics is personal and I never endorse someone or talk about it in church or with other people unless I am really really close to them and know that it will be kept in confidence.


    Sojourners put out a message last election to remind people that God is not a Republician nor a Democrat. There are people on both sides with very strong Christian beliefs - Jimmy Carter for example is a very devout Baptist and Democrat.  

  • ajforward007

    i am so glad you wrote this post!


    i am a christian democrat and i get pretty tired of people trying to convince me otherwise.

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