Wednesday, 23 July 2008

  • Bible Translations: Feel-Good Factor vs. Accuracy

    oaktree by revelife crew

    message There's been a lot of discussion going on in this forum thread about whether you can depend on Bible translations that are thought-by-thought (think paraphrases like "The Message") or if we should put more weight on Bible translations that are more accurate word-by-word (The New American Standard Bible.) For the most part, people are reading the NIV, which is conservative but not entirely accurate as far as language goes, but people are debating the merit of studying something that deviates from the original language's meaning.

    Drewdixon said, "The Message is not scripture. The Message is quite nice for reading narrative stories. But when you are studying deeper, theological portions of scripture (like Romans or really any of the epistles) the Message cannot be trusted. It is a paraphrase. You can also note that on the front and spine of the book it has an author: Eugene H. Peterson. This book is authored by him, not by God. Honestly, I find The Message very confusing at times. By rewording things and inserting outlandish phrases it can either distort the original intent of Scripture or completely change its meaning. I encourage anyone who uses The Message for study to please go get a Bible and set down Mr. Peterson's book."

    Conradma added, "Quite frankly, I don't think there is a best translation. I believe everyone should get in the habit of cross checking translations to figure out what God is really saying. I think if you had the time and money to do it, everyone should learn Greek and Hebrew and go back to the original texts. For a common Layman like me, I never have the time or i just have the lack of motivation to do it."

    Which translations of the Bible do you read? How do you study the Bible?

    Head on over to the forums to check out more of the discussion and revelifer-recommended Bible translations.

Comments (25)

  • Kristenmomof3@xanga

    I read KJV I also Like reading my German Luther Bible

    I Also have a Greek New Testament

    and I love The Evidence Bible by Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron

  • JadedJanissary@xanga

    Frankly, the usefulness of word for word translations is a bit dubious.  They are really only particularly helpful if one has a VERY strong grasp of the culture and meaning behind them, especially with some of the epistles and the OT.  

  • bittersunday@xanga

    I usually read NIV.  All of my family does, except my father.  He reads an ancient Greek Bible.

  • EilisAngelos@xanga

    Actually just today the new Bible that I ordered came in to my book store. I can't tell you how thrilled I am to have it. It's an NASB version Greek & Hebrew Key Word Study Bible. This is what I'll be using for my Bible study time from now on. ^_^ (It's come very highly recommended to me by scholars and even a few laymen.)

  • MinOfDef

    I switched to NASB for a couple years and I am going to start using the ESV as well. To study the Word, I depend on the NASB, an Illustrated Bible Dictionary by Hollman, and to get into the grit, an interlinear Greek with NASB. I agree with Conradma... you really don't know what you're missing until you study the Greek and Hebrew. Not to mention all the historical and cultural context that we miss because we think of it in today's terms. 

  • OsuwarInuyasha@xanga

    I like the New Living Translation, I have found that I understand more about the Bible after using it (even more then the NIV). I guess its just easier for me to comprehend. I have the application study Bible and I love it.

  • a_defiantbeauty_2@xanga

    I read the NIV and the NET bible. The NET bible can be found online @ www.nextbible.org

  • sheepthatsblack@xanga

    www.biblegateway.com

    All the popular translations (in several languages) with the click of a pop-down menu....

    I like the NLT, but I like to cross-check stuff even more...

  • LecardeX@xanga

    People are much too concerned about the words on the page rather than the spirit that wrote them.  It doesn't matter what translation you read, the holy spirit can and will teach you no matter what you use.  I recently bought an NIV Archaeology study Bible and The Message.  NIV is nice for in depth study, but The Message makes everything so much easier to understand.  I could never bring myself to read the Bible, the language was always so against the natural flow of thought.  The Message is just readable to me.
    I bet if you asked Peterson if he wrote the Bible, he wouldn't say "yes."  I highly doubt he claims the glory for anything in the Bible.

  • docsfancyskip@xanga

    I read the New American Version (St. Joseph Edition)


    I read a devotional book called Devotions for Women on the go! It rocks my world, and it keeps me focused!


    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0842357572


    Give it a shot if you aren't sure..

  • Roadkill_Spatula@xanga

    When I took Bible translation courses, our training was in meaning-based translation, which involved figuring out what verses and passages mean and translating from the meaning rather than just translating the words and phrases literally. Our teacher said, "Never translate from the Living Bible, but never translate without reading the Living Bible!"


    It's good to have both a fairly literal translation (NASB, NKJV) and an idiomatic translation (NLV, TEV). If I only read literal translations (and even the NIV is overly literal in places), there is a lot that gets by me, because I understand the words but not the meaning.


    Many times in the men's Bible study I co-lead, guys will read from the KJV or NASB something like, "And this I pray, that your love may abound still more and more in real knowledge and all discernment, so that you may approve the things that are excellent, in order to be sincere and blameless until the day of Christ, having been filled with the fruit of righteousness which comes through Jesus Christ, to the glory and praise of God."


    When I ask what it means for love to abound in knowledge and discernment, or to approve the things that are excellent, I get a lot of head-scratching.


    The New Living divides the first verse into two parts, and clarifies the language throughout: "I pray that your love will overflow more and more, and that you will keep on growing in knowledge and understanding. For I want you to understand what really matters, so that you may live pure and blameless lives until the day of Christ’s return. May you always be filled with the fruit of your salvation—the righteous character produced in your life by Jesus Christ—for this will bring much glory and praise to God." This is certainly clearer, whether or not you agree that it's accurate.


    The Message includes even more elaboration: "So this is my prayer: that your love will flourish and that you will not only love much but well. Learn to love appropriately. You need to use your head and test your feelings so that your love is sincere and intelligent, not sentimental gush. Live a lover's life, circumspect and exemplary, a life Jesus will be proud of: bountiful in fruits from the soul, making Jesus Christ attractive to all, getting everyone involved in the glory and praise of God."


    Great stuff, and pretty much on the mark. A good supplement to the more literal translations. Both The Message and the NLV provide some reliable guidance as to how to decipher the tightly-packed language of the literal versions.


    Biblegateway.com is a great resource, by the way. Twenty respected English versions, and a number of other languages as well.

  • Stacey@xanga

    KJV 1611 all the way baby... It's the only one that doesn't lie to you.  Look at Mark 1:2, most Bibles read, "As it is written in Isaiah the Prophet"  Then the reference it gives takes you to Malachai.  The King James reads only, "As it is written in the Prophets" 

  • raphahrose@xanga

     As a new believer 21 yrs ago..... it was NIV, because everybody at the little church we attended used it.  I had my hubby's old RSV and I liked the poetic nature so read that for my devotion time.  The past decade, I've led FCA at our high school, and while I don't remember how I came across it, I've used and enjoyed very much the NLT.  IT made God's word come alive for my teen girls... in basketball chapels.  I had girls who had never been to church ever, sit and listen with true openness, they understood!! and appreciated!!  things God is saying, through His word. It has been very to His glory, wonderful.  I still use it, for personal devotions, but for Bible study, I use a few different ones, back to NIV, typically, and still, my NLT unfolds meaning in a way I get.   I bought The Message, for personal reading, but that's far as I use it, guess, cuz I like the poetic rhythm. God speaks to me through His word, period.

  • shards_of_beauty@xanga

    I read ESV; when I study I use ESV and NASB cross-checked and sometimes NIV and NKJV; for particularly confusing passages I use a variety of commentaries.  I think that if you're really wanting in-depth study it's best to use something that is more literal... I really struggle with paraphrases like The Message, especially used as a study Bible, but then I'm biased because one of my high school youth pastors taught out of The Message and totally twisted scripture so I kinda got turned off by that...

  • RantDog@xanga

    As was mentioned above, it's the Spirit that counts. We need to focusing on the literalness (or lack of it) and jot/tittle accuracy (or lack of it) of the written words.
    Instead, we must ask: Is my reading of whatever version, NASB, NIV, Message ... French, Swahili, German, Greek, etc, bringing me closer to the Living Word.

  • madhatter660@xanga

    i am partial to the New King James Version, i like that's very literal yet really easy to understand (at least for me). i do admit that there are times when i sit there and go "huh?" but generally i get it and if i don't i use the trusty online source of biblegateway.com to help me out. also, when there's a passage that's long and wordy, i break it down part by part to see what the individual parts mean. i find it easier that way. there's not much, if any, paraphrasing and the language isn't stricken with thy's, thee's, thou's, etc

  • BohemianLamb

    I primarily read the NLT (Life Application Study Bible FTW!). I get the heebie jeebies about the NIV (I don't know why). But for serious study, I almost always read the same passages in NASB, Amplified and KJV as well. Sometimes if I am struggling with a particular passage really hitting home, I will read it in MSG as well just to see if it hits any differently. I absolutely love biblegateway.com and use it constantly, but if I couldn't use that I have a 4 translation parallel bible that contains all the above translations I mentioned except for MSG. So it works. 

  • all_usernames_have_been_taken

    I personally use a TNIV translation, because I needed a new Bible and it was free. But I'm not against Bible's like "The Message." In this case, this translation is not just paraphrase, it actually provides quite a bit of interpretation of the original text. I do believe it is important to use a more literal translation like KJV, NKJV, or NIV for in-depth studies of the many different meanings of the text. Peterson himself, in his book "A Long Obedience in the Same Direction" encourages people to use a more literal translation when doing deeper studies of passages.


    For me, using and cross-referencing different translations (this includes The Message as well as original Greek, etc.) is important to be able to see the text in a new way. It puts you in a different perspective, shows it to you in a new light, and can make you think about the text in a deeper way. It goes beyond the surface reading that we can get accustomed to by reading the same version over and over.


    I am, though, against translations that cut out important phrases or sections of different passages, or try to skew the meaning intentionally by using different wording. This is just plain wrong, like God told us in His Word.

  • mrsviolet

    At home the NIV or the NKJV.

    Online I cross check various versions.  I particularly like going to the greek or hebrew text and checking the various transliterations of the words used.

    I like the Message for the simplicity of the it.  If the particular verse measures up ok in content with the NIV or NKJV then I will post with that.

    For many non-Christians the word of God can be quite a scary or daunting thing to read, so I find the Message a nice place to start if it is true to the original context.

    I certainly don't use the Message for a 'feel good factor', but I do use it because it is milk for those unfamiliar with the scriptures.

    x

  • mrsviolet

    @RantDog@xanga - Amen, it is the Rhema word.... that brings life to the Spirit.

    x

  • Roadkill_Spatula@xanga

    @Stacey@xanga - The Isaiah reference is to the second part of the quote. Mark 1:3 is a direct quotation of Isaiah 40:3. (But I'm sure you know that already.)

  • Teufels_Hofnarr@xanga

    The fact that God needed to be translated in the first place has always truck me as suspicious

  • tnladywolfe@xanga

    i like the KJV but i have many other versions also. I had gotten these when i was new in Christ but since then have seen the mistakes in the other versions so i use them mostly as references to something i may not "get" when i'm reading something in the KJV.  i also have a greek/hebrew bible that i love as well.  KJV when reading or studying the Word of God.

  • too_pretty_to_die@xanga

    as a Biblical scholar in training, i gotta tell you that the KJV is widely considered the absolute WORST translation.  the authors sacrificed so much accuracy for poetry.  it makes me gag.

    i'm actually getting ready to study Greek and Hebrew so i can read the original texts.  accuracy is the most important thing to me.

  • edire@xanga

    I enjoy reading my Bible every day. My favorite is the Beck, otherwise known as 'An American Translation.' Dr. William Beck had a driving devotion to the cause of simplifying the English Bible for people of all ages is evident as you read this translation. The Beck is out of print and is a rare find indeed. I like to write out verses two or three at a time, maybe more, in my own printed handwriting and allow my study to spring from this practice. I find this enlightening. Words spring up to meet me and more meaning is grasped and I write my impressions and develop cross references as the Lord leads me. Bible study is the most fascinating kind of study anyone can imagine, especially if their faith is truly in the right place. We all have a place at the cross. 

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